Conservatory fitting issue
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I won't mention the company's name yet, but their initials begin and end with a W. They have been trading for 35 years, but they will only be as good as their current surveyor/fitters.
I have tried hard to head-off problems but communication, paperwork etc has been dire. They couldn't supply me a correct email address for their surveyor, as they couldn't spell his name.
Yesterday, I was asked why we hadn't clad the fascias ready for the fitting of the company's guttering to the rest of the building's rear elevation. My answer was simple: no one had explained that we should!
Duraflex make profiles then sell these to fabricators. To determine the technical data on your roof you need to determine who the fabricator was. This may not be the same as conservatory fabricator and will not be the same company as the roof glazing manufacturer. Is your roof profile aluminium?0 -
UPDATE:
The roof was fitted last week, which involved welding together a box gutter on site. As you will see from the diagram, I'd specified two roof windows originally and increased this to 3 later, because we're south facing and I wanted plenty of ventilation.
The night after the roof went up, it rained, the box gutter leaked at or near to the weld point and the roof windows failed to clear themselves of water when the weather improved, having a 3cm pool of water at the lower edge. That pool of water is still there on all of them, so we can assume it will be more or less permanent at this time of year and eventually go green etc.
Since I emailed the guy in charge of the job about the leak/windows etc, keeping the paper trail going, no one has visited the site.
Yesterday, I heard back from the suppliers of the roof vents, who told me that to clear themselves of water properly, they'd need around 20 degrees of roof slope. We have 5 degrees.
On getting that news, I again emailed the guy in charge (he's also the 'designer') saying that I'm not satisfied, restating the problems and suggesting all work is halted until he can come up with written proposals for their solution and we agree them.
Think this is going to get really messy now!
Anything else I should do?0 -
I'd keep copious photos and video of the problem as a record. I would try to be as clear with myself what desirable solution I wanted, and also what realistic compromise I would accept. I would (in the Colemanballs Private Eye style) play devil's apricot and think what the installer wants, and would find a reasonable compromise, and try to work out a happy medium between those positions.
There are certainly faults here that need rectifying and, as they are meant to be the experts, they should have informed you of potential problems with the design in advance. However, it may be near-impossible to provide a perfect solution to your design.
In all likelihood, you are either going to have to accept the roof pooling water, or no openers, or a change in roof angle. The latter may not be possible, would cost a fortune,. The former may be easiest, but least satisfactory. Would no openings work?
Although I understand your reasoning, I'm not sure I would have stated all work is halted, as that removes the workmen who need to remedy the problem from site.0 -
They took them off site last Thursday anyway, without warning and before the further problems were known, so I thought it would be an opportune moment to agree a way forward before they return.I'm not sure I would have stated all work is halted, as that removes the workmen who need to remedy the problem from site.
The other ponts you make more or less summarise my thinking. However I don't agree with the words 'my design,' as it was originally explained that this box gutter would allow raising or lowering the roof angle, as required. I took it that the angle chosen by them would be OK. Now it looks as if they just chose cheap.
After all, they've made hundreds of these things, and I'm on my first!0 -
Misquote alert.....
... Well, wrong emphasis from me, actually 
I started with:
"potential problems with the design"
which was followed by :
"However, it may be near-impossible to provide a perfect solution to your redesign".. where I've added the red re...
What I'm suggesting is, come up with the solution you want, and explain it clearly. However, accept that a remedy may well require further compromise - which I well-know you accept anyway.
As you state in your last sentence; they are the experts, and it's up to them to make things work, or not accept the job in the first place (unless they clearly state: "we'll do it, but it will fall down within six months, mate")!
Edit: adding bits while working. Hoping you get resolutions to both current problems, as getting the wood burners done early next year, rapidly followed by a conservatory! I watch with more than a passing interest! 0 -
That whole job looks like a cheap bodge by a cowboy builder.
Name and shame!"A nation's greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members." ~ Mahatma Gandhi
Ride hard or stay home :iloveyou:0 -
That whole job looks like a cheap bodge by a cowboy builder.
Name and shame!
I do not believe this will work. If I think back over conservatory plans I have viewed in recent years from a variety of companies, all were defective. Following this onwards, none of the installation companies I have dealt with have cared about anything.
The entire industry is an unregulated area of unskilled, semi skilled, untrained and unprofessional folks. Consequently it would be unfair to name and shame just one company - they are all the same!
Back to Davesnave - the pragmatic answer is to delete the roof vents and go for a fully glazed roof. Then consider your ventilation - this may well be adequate based on opening windows, night latch settings and trickle vents in all the frames/sashes - you have specified all these I assume?0 -
I'm no great fan of "name & shame" either, as it just entrenches those who wouldn't be helpful, and punishes those who made a chicken-up, and endeavour to fix it over time. Generally, there's just little point in bothering.
Mind you, I haven't found conservatory and window firms that much worse than plumbers and roofers... Some obviously are, but many are reasonably honest, reasonably keen to give service. Probably more common amongst the local traders, where reputation and recommendation matter most. Are they all the same? I've had one pretty bad one (but was expecting it, they were very cheap, and I was moving soon), and one excellent (came back with other prospective clients over a year later, spotted on window showing some sign of failure which I hadn't noticed, and some movement of lead flashing; pointed it out to me, fixed it several days later, boss came back to check it all over, and still wasn't satisfied with roof, which was further re-jigged).
Losing the roof vents would be my preferred option too, but I'm no fan of them. (I am a fan of fans, come to that, and have bunged two large ceiling ones in my last conservatory.) Increased window ventilation might help, but it won't be as effective at losing summer heat, especially if the thing has any south facing aspect. Changing the whole roof angle will involve a complete new roof, and new end eves. It may also look odd on the narrowest end, which would have a steep pitch on a short length.0 -
Losing the roof vents would be my preferred option too, but I'm no fan of them. (I am a fan of fans, come to that, and have bunged two large ceiling ones in my last conservatory.) Increased window ventilation might help, but it won't be as effective at losing summer heat, especially if the thing has any south facing aspect. Changing the whole roof angle will involve a complete new roof, and new end eves. It may also look odd on the narrowest end, which would have a steep pitch on a short length.
For most folks hell will freeze over before a conservatory company will do that. The costs are substantial, and companies will do anything to delay, bodge, whatever before that happens.
I am dealing with one at the moment where the roof leaks - the company have been playing around with bodged repairs for two years now. The company is now suggesting the conservatory needs to be dismantled and rebuilt. In a nutshell their fitters of long standing (probably 30 years experience with the one fitter) were cowboys. But year in and year out they get away with being cowboys. Why? Because it is a hugely profitable, unregulated industry.
I am not naming and shaming that company because that will not help me get a resolution.0 -
I won't name and shame because the independent reviews on a review site are generally positive, although there are a few quite notable exceptions. They've also been trading for 35 years from a site formerly managed by my builder, when he worked in a different capacity, hence my choice. He now has a red face too!
I agree that the compromise I'll probably have to go for is to do away with the roof vents. There are 4 x 1metre wide tilt & turn windows at the front, which open right up, plus the French doors, so plenty of ventilation was planned-in.
But the bottom line is that the Consumer Rights Act says we ought to be able to rely on what the seller tells us. What their surveyor said (I have witnesses) is that the box gutter could overcome any problems getting the right pitch.
I know there were problems with both the salesman's deal and his 'survey' which meant that we did exceptionally well price wise, but that's irrelevant. I didn't call him in late January because Iwanted a high price! I still have the initial drawing, presumably done by him, which underestimates the size by about a third. :rotfl:
The fitters are very good. It's everyone else....0
This discussion has been closed.
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