Resident Permit

LiamSwindon · 18 May 2017 at 6:35PM

Hello,

I desperately need help as I'm getting angrier and angrier at the parking company and feel like common sense has gone out of the window.

I received a parking charge notice for not having my residents vehicle pass displayed in the window. I own the space as it comes with my flat. A few weeks after moving in we were told that a new parking system is in place and we have to display passes.

I forgot on an occasion to display the pass. It is not stuck in my windscreen permanently due to:

1) it has postcode and that causes security issues for me
2) myself and my partner share the space (we can pay another £10 to buy another)

I paid a lot of money for the flat and space so did not want to buy another pass.

They sent me a letter after requesting my details from the DVLA. I tried to appeal to them but stupidly got one letter wrong from my number plate so they said a charge wasn't on record. When I eventually realised my mistake they said they would not communicate with me unless I am the driver or registered keeper. My original email said that I wasn't the driver or keeper but as I wanted to communicate and I wanted the matter resolved I said that I was. (I wish I read these forums first!)

I sent them a picture of my vehicle pass next to my number plate as proof that it is my space. They said that it states on the signs showing passes retrospectively will not be allowed. They say that my fine still stands at £60.

I phoned up to discuss this with a person. She wouldn't put me through to a manager when she said there was nothing she can do and then she hung up on me. My argument is that they have lost no money as it's my vehicle that would park there.

I appealed to the IAS who said I have to pay as I've breached a 'contract'. This contract has been imposed on me as what other option is there.

I spoke to the freeholder and management company who both say that the scheme is in place to fight 'historic parking issues'. I have argued that me parking in my own space is not an historic parking issue. It's not even an issue.

The latest is that the management company is saying that it wouldn't be manageable to have a rule in place that sending proof of a vehicle pass is ok retrospectively.

All of those I have spoken to say there is nothing that can be done and say I should pay. The fine is now at £100. They threaten court action and I am happy to argue my case there in the vain hope that there are people left in this world with an ounce of common sense. I want to make sure that I would win and not be left with a charge that is even worse than £100 to park in my own space.

I've realised I've made many mistakes along the way and am looking for advice.

The lease I have signed when I bought the place does not specifically mention the particulars of a parking scheme but says that I would have to abide by any parking regulations the management company set out (or words to that effect).

Do I pay and stop being stubborn or do I take them on and fight for the right of every resident to not be treated like a cash cow.

The parking company will not respond to my emails now and I'm pretty sure the management company are at the end of their tether with me and will soon refuse to talk.

Please can someone with more experience than me advise what to do?

Thanks in advance.

Liam

Umkomaas · 18 May 2017 at 6:42PM

Do I pay and stop being stubborn or do I take them on and fight for the right of every resident to not be treated like a cash cow.

No, you don't pay. You continue to be stubborn.

There are so many of these residential parking issues coming to the fore. All are beatable. You're beyond the appeal stages of the PPC and IAS, so you now ignore everything other than a LBC or MCOL.

Do plenty of reading of similar cases to see how others have handled them. Here's a classic on PePiPoo to start you off.

http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=110949

And others here on MSE.

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5651115

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5588292&highlight=hairray

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5649274&highlight=hairray

Please tell us who the parking company is.

Coupon-mad · 19 May 2017 at 12:48AM

Read Hairray's thread in particular, with the 'LBA' letters for Managing Agents and the PPC.

LiamSwindon · 19 May 2017 at 6:47AM

That's excellent thanks for your quick replies!

The company is Parking and Property Management.

The management company employing them (who are communicating with me as PandP are ignoring me) Cleaver Property Management.

So frustrating!

Fruitcake · 19 May 2017 at 8:52AM

Send the MA and the parking scammers a cease and desist letter along with a statement that you withdraw any implied right of access to your demised space and any further tickets will be considered as trespass and harassment.

Quote the court cases from the Prankster's blogspot below, pointing out that judges have said that a third party(MA and scammers) cannot add on Ts and Cs to an existing contract (lease/AST).

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/residential-parking.html

In particular ...

In Pace v Mr N [2016] C6GF14F0 [2016] it was found that the parking company could not override the tenant's right to park by requiring a permit to park.

Please also clarify your previous comments about ownership of the parking space. In one place you say you own it but in another you refer to your lease.

The_Deep · 19 May 2017 at 9:33AM

Send you MA a copy of this

http://www.consumeractiongroup.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?377246-UKPC-liable-for-trespass-**SUCCESS**

You have an excellent chance of making the PPC pay a considerable amount of money here for harassing tenants, and the MA forr failing to put the best interests if the residents first. If more MAs are taken to task for employing these parasites the more likely it will be that some will go to the wall.

LiamSwindon · 19 May 2017 at 11:52AM

Hiya,

Thanks guys 😊

Sorry I was unclear, I bought the flat and it came with the space. I have to pay ground rent to the freeholder annually. I can't remember the exact wording of the lease, I am not able to check until Sunday now. It does mention if parking regulations come in then I'd have to adhere to them I think but it doesn't mention a pass.

I emailed the MA asking why the decision was made to have that as part of the 'contract' when it is of no benefit to residents They keep referring to 'historical parking issues'.

I also asked the MA to send me a copy of the contract that shows their responsibilities as when I said that I would get a petition signed by the residents she said that those renting the flats (who aren't leaseholders) opinions wouldn't count. This seemed odd as they are here for the residents and not leaseholders.

I also asked why it couldn't be just cancelled. She said that it would not be viable. I said that I would like a financial breakdown of what it costs them to cancel a charge (as it's just a click of a button probably) and she said it's not the money that's the issue but the admin behind it. Load of rubbish.

The_Deep · 19 May 2017 at 12:35PM

Whilst MAs may be entitled to impose certain regulations for the greater good. employing a PPC is not one of them, especially if that PPC seeks to restrict a resident's rights.

I agree with the MA that the views of tenants should be discounted. Tenants come and go, their priorities are not necessarily shared by their landlord, and MAs should not have to deal with tenants.

DoaM · 19 May 2017 at 12:46PM

The_Deep wrote: »

I agree with the MA that the views of tenants should be discounted. Tenants come and go, their priorities are not necessarily shared by their landlord, and MAs should not have to deal with tenants.

But in this case the OP isn't a tenant - he's an owner who so happens to have leasehold rather than freehold ownership.

The_Deep · 19 May 2017 at 12:59PM

But in this case the OP isn't a tenant - he's an owner who so happens to have leasehold rather than freehold ownership.

Yes I am aware of that. Most flats are leasehold.

LiamSwindon · 19 May 2017 at 6:57PM

Here's the response from the MA.

Further to your email below.

I understand you have already spoken to "freeholder" at Thomas Homes and Parking & Property Management regarding an appeal. Both have confirmed, as I do now, that the ticket is still valid as the permit was not displayed.

I attach the confirmation from "freeholder" which was sent to you on 2nd May outlining what you need to do now. I have also spoken to PPM this AM and they confirm that as the outstanding amount has not been paid as yet, the permit with no postcode has not been sent out. This will be done, as agreed, once the amount is paid in settlement.

To answer your query on historical parking issues. We have had lots of issues with residents with 2 vehicles parking a second car in other resident spaces, also we have had shoppers parking in residents bays and have had had numerous calls and emails on this subject across the sites. Therefore, in communication with the Directors at Thomas Homes, it was agreed that Parking Control was the only sensible option. The Lease supports this action and is necessary to ensure the smooth running of the development long term. We signed the contract for PPM to be on site, their legal advisors also checked the Lease to ensure this was OK to move forward and warden the site.

I am sorry that you are unhappy with the method of Parking Control but due to a high volume of complaints from residents over an extended period of time, we have had no option but to implement this system.

I took out some names and places as I thought that'd be unfair.

Resident Permit

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