Green, ethical, energy issues in the news

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  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    Swansea tidal scheme is still trying:-

    Lagoon cost 'same as Hinkley'
    Tidal Lagoon Power has claimed the lifetime cost to consumers of its proposed Swansea Bay tidal lagoon would be the same as the Hinkley Point C nuclear plant in Somerset.

    In its report published today, The New Power Cost League Table, the Gloucester developer said the 320MW Swansea Bay tidal lagoon would have a lifetime cost of £25.78 per megawatt-hour, based on a Contract for Difference for 90 years and operational lifetime of 120 years.

    There's also a very brief mention of the Cardiff Tidal Lagoon costs.

    Mart.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    Quite an interesting article trying to weigh up all the pro's and con's of each form of generation to give them an overall score.

    Wind and PV do well, but pro nukers probably don't want to read para 1 of 'Flexible'.

    7 Factors Show Why Wind & Solar Are The 1st Choices

    Doubt everyone will agree on all the scores, but a good breakdown of the key requirements, none the less.

    Mart.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • Exiled_Tyke
    Exiled_Tyke Posts: 1,190 Forumite
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    Martyn1981 wrote: »
    Quite an interesting article trying to weigh up all the pro's and con's of each form of generation to give them an overall score.

    Wind and PV do well, but pro nukers probably don't want to read para 1 of 'Flexible'.

    7 Factors Show Why Wind & Solar Are The 1st Choices

    Doubt everyone will agree on all the scores, but a good breakdown of the key requirements, none the less.

    Mart.

    Excellent article summarising the issues. As you suggest the scores are debatable but the arguments are strong. I do despair at the government's keenness on Hinckley and am still hoping they will eventually conclude that it isn't viable.
    Install 28th Nov 15, 3.3kW, (11x300LG), SolarEdge, SW. W Yorks.
    Install 2: Sept 19, 600W SSE
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  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    Exiled_Tyke wrote: »
    I do despair at the government's keenness on Hinckley and am still hoping they will eventually conclude that it isn't viable.

    I strongly suspect that they already know it's unviable, but I think the poison pill is about £18bn if they pull out, so they need EDF to withdraw. I think it can be cancelled if it isn't running by a certain date, which may be 2030, and that's not as bad as it sounds since the latest estimates are 2028+.

    Recent news has upped the build cost again from £24bn to about £37bn ...... hard to comprehend.

    People probably assume I'm against nuclear on ideological grounds, but actually I'm not. I think nuclear is cleaner than coal (so long as it doesn't go bang), I just no longer think it's financially viable. Plus, coal's as good as dead already in the UK.

    Had it started generating in 2012 at £92.50/MWh, then that would have been ok. Nice reduction in CO2, similar price to on-shore wind and a bit cheaper than PV. It would have been a lot cheaper than off-shore wind at around £140, and the 35 year subsidy, probably worth it.

    But now in 2016, the inflationary protected price is £99, more than on-shore wind, large scale PV and even domestic PV. Off-shore is down to £120, and Siemens and Dong Energy are predicting €80 or less (see earlier article on the Dutch contract).

    When I argue elsewhere (I don't just annoy folk on here) they all defend nuclear by saying the next design, the next deal, the next contract will be cheap ...... well where are they, and how come none of those 'cheap' reactors have licences yet?

    Time to move on, me thinks. The cost margin between renewables and nuclear will shortly cover storage or overcapacity building, so why keep flogging this dead white elephant ..... mixed up my metaphors a bit there! :p

    Mart.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • lstar337
    lstar337 Posts: 3,441 Forumite
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    The reactor we need now is a LFTR to burn up our current stock of nuclear waste.
  • zeupater
    zeupater Posts: 5,355 Forumite
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    Is DECC a dead duck ??

    Lots of ministerial changes but not noticed anything related to DECC yet .... maybe energy and climate will move elsewhere (business/environment ??) ...

    .... anyone else's phone on at the moment just in case No10 regularly read these threads .... ;)

    Z ... :cool:
    "We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
    B)
  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    DECC appears doomed

    Mart.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • zeupater
    zeupater Posts: 5,355 Forumite
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    Martyn1981 wrote: »
    DECC appears doomed

    Mart.
    ... Business, Energy & Industrial Strategy ... looks like the energy side has just been accounted for, so climate change goes where ? .... DEFRA ? ....

    Z
    "We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
    B)
  • Martyn1981
    Martyn1981 Posts: 14,762 Forumite
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    zeupater wrote: »
    so climate change goes where ?

    Z

    Boris and Nigel are 'sending it back where it came from'.

    That's how Britain will solve all its problems from now on! ;)

    Mart.
    Mart. Cardiff. 5.58 kWp PV systems (3.58 ESE & 2.0 WNW)

    For general PV advice please see the PV FAQ thread on the Green & Ethical Board.
  • michaels
    michaels Posts: 28,003 Forumite
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    Martyn1981 wrote: »
    Yep, scary wind prices if you happen to be the competition.

    With a cf of 50% this may be bad news for on-shore wind too, though I think there are differences in the generation patterns. Presumably PV is safe having a summer bias.

    Also, what does it mean for storage? With prices that low overcapacity could simply be a better alternative, plus industries will always crop up to make use of cheap/free leccy, such as H2 production. [I believe it's fair to put economical overcapacity in the same category as storage when considering intermittent generation.]

    Fingers crossed these prices are repeatable, possibly down to the deployment now of specialist construction techniques and ships, the possible move to floating bases, and the move towards vast turbines 8MW (perhaps bigger).

    If the first half of this decade belongs to PV development, perhaps the second half will be owned by off-shore wind.

    BTW, have you seen these graphics on the (theoretical) levels of off-shore wind or PV needed to meet the world's energy (not leccy) requirements.

    Mart.

    With Smart meters etc you can probably dump excess leccy generation into people's hot water tanks like we do with the iBoost. And even into electric car batteries / other distributed battery storage.....
    I think....
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