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UKPC Ticket Belfast HELP PLEASE!!

flixxchick
flixxchick Posts: 13 Forumite
edited 21 February 2013 at 12:59PM in Parking tickets, fines & parking
Hi Guys. I have been reading this forum for a number of years but have never needed to ask a question as I always got my answers from other posts :)

I have read all the threads regarding UKPC tickets and I understand everyone says to ignore them and I had fully intended to until I was talking to someone from Citizens Advice. Well!!!......they well and truly put the wind up me. They asked me was I prepared to take this thing the whole way to court if it came to it - well, umm.... maybe not!!?? That really scares me silly!!! :eek: They said if it does go that far I will need to show that I tried to negotiate with them, tried to sort it out basically!!

I can’t afford the £90 they are asking for at the minute so there’s no way in hell I can afford to go to court. I have drafted up a letter to them but haven’t sent it as yet. Would someone please look it over for me as I’m no good at this type of thing. I used the template letter from Martin with a few additions of my own. I would really appreciate it.

I understand the whole ‘Unfair Consumer Contract Regulations’ thing and I know the charges are completely extortionate as to park for a full day in a paid ticketed car park in Belfast City Centre is only £4.50 so how can they justify £90 in a free car park!!!!!!???? THEY CAN’T!!!!! I know all this, this is not what I’m asking. It’s the whole court thing. Does anyone have any experience with one of these things going the whole way to court and do they have any way I could get out of it without having to pay big money???

This is the letter I have drafted:

Dear Sir/Madam,

Ref number:
Vehicle registration number:

You issued me with a parking ticket on ????????? but I believe it was unlawfully issued and I will not be meeting your demand for payment.

Firstly, I only learned about this ticket when I received your letter on ???????. There was no ticket on the car on ????????. I do realise that you have photos with the ticket displayed on the bottom corner of the passenger window but this was not there when returning, so someone must have removed it.

Secondly, I never saw any signs when entering the car park about any sort of fines or terms and conditions, and I’ve been parking in that car park since it opened. Therefore I believe I never entered into any sort of ‘contract’ with either you or the landowner. Tell them to erect BIGGER/CLEARER signs!

The main reason I will not be paying this extortionate amount of money is:
The fee is disproportionate
(Under common law, the cost of a penalty must reflect the damages suffered by the company issuing it.)
According to the Unfair Consumer Contract Regulations, parking charges on private land must not exceed the cost to the landowner during the period the motorist is parked there. In my case, the £90 charge you are asking for far exceeds the cost to the landowner on a FREE car park.

If you choose to pursue me please be aware that I will not enter into any correspondence and this will be the only letter you will receive from me until you address the specific points raised in my letter.

Yours faithfully,


Thank you :)
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Comments

  • I don't know if anyone on here is Au Fait with the regs for NI so as an addition post on the private parking section on pepipoo.com, they have a lot of people on there who should be able to help you.
    ps, Citizens Advice ALWAYS say pay up, its all they know.
    I'd rather be an Optimist and be proved wrong than a Pessimist and be proved right.
  • The law here is the same as the rest of the UK - you can IGNORE this speculative invoice.

    Citizens advice obviously need some additional training
    The Daily Mail
    Tagline - "Why let the truth get in the way of a story to incense Middle England"
  • I don't know if anyone on here is Au Fait with the regs for NI so as an addition post on the private parking section on pepipoo.com, they have a lot of people on there who should be able to help you.
    ps, Citizens Advice ALWAYS say pay up, its all they know.

    Thanks for your reply :)
    I may be wrong but I don't think pepipoo covers Northern Ireland!!??
  • Have you asked?
    I'd rather be an Optimist and be proved wrong than a Pessimist and be proved right.
  • spacey2012
    spacey2012 Posts: 5,836
    First Anniversary First Post Combo Breaker
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    I often think if the citizens Advice must be in on the scam ?
    They do issue absolute bull$hit for advice on the fake parking ticket scam.
    They get this advice from the trade club of the scammers.
    For an organisation that boasts to have barristers working for them, you really would think they would seek the legal position on these Impersonation of real parking tickets scams.
    It just does not add up, somewhere someone must be up to it.
    Be happy...;)
  • Have you asked?

    I'm just gonna check it out now, cheers :)
  • spacey2012 wrote: »
    I often think if the citizens Advice must be in on the scam ?
    They do issue absolute bull$hit for advice on the fake parking ticket scam.
    They get this advice from the trade club of the scammers.
    For an organisation that boasts to have barristers working for them, you really would think they would seek the legal position on these Impersonation of real parking tickets scams.
    It just does not add up, somewhere someone must be up to it.

    You could be right ya know. They hadn't even seen one of the letters I received. They did read through it, said it look official, then looked really, really shocked when I said I had no intention of paying it and was going to ignore.

    From a legal point of view they said having some sort of proof I tried to sort it out would help my case if it ever did come to court. Then they started going on about court fees and the other sides legal cost. Scared the **** outta me to be honest :(
  • Coupon-mad
    Coupon-mad Posts: 130,505
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    edited 21 February 2013 at 10:38PM
    flixxchick wrote: »
    You could be right ya know. They hadn't even seen one of the letters I received. They did read through it, said it look official, then looked really, really shocked when I said I had no intention of paying it and was going to ignore.

    From a legal point of view they said having some sort of proof I tried to sort it out would help my case if it ever did come to court. Then they started going on about court fees and the other sides legal cost. Scared the **** outta me to be honest :(



    Ignore it completely and COMPLAIN to the Line Manager at the CAB that wrong advice has been given about fake PCNs. For the CAB to be taking it seriously is naive at the very least, sharp practice even. It only takes a quick Google to understand the facts:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XAIcdi9niHA

    Letters to expect from these cowboys:

    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=2329119

    In NI, there is no POPLA appeals service so there is no point whatsoever in appealing. No point at all. You are right about the unclear signs issue but it's not worth wasting a stamp over. Far easier to ignore UKPC.

    And shove this fact down the CAB's throat. UKPC have NEVER taken anyone to Court, almost no PPC ever tries a small claim at all. A PPC would lose a defended claim.

    And just as importantly, UKPC do not own the car park (they own none AFAIK) so have no right to 'offer spaces to park' and certainly no right to any small claim. In theory the landowner could, if there was a loss proveable - but not a private firm with a few signs up and no ownership rights and no way to 'offer' the parking space (the landowner/occupier offers it, not them).

    Therefore no contract exists and no loss has been suffered by UKPC. The same is true for ANY PPC that does not own or have leasehold property rights in the car park. They act as 'agents' for the landowner only, on a contract with the landowner basis only. There is no enforceable contract they can make with a driver.

    They have no other rights, it's all bluff and bluster involving some signs, some pieces of paper and an impersonation of authority that the CAB should really see right through.

    The CAB should be embarrassed about their advice - we understand that it was written by a PPC owner years ago who was also a CAB adviser at the time. It's advice based on a bias, a severe conflict of interests that has never been resolved despite letters pointing it out. COMPLAIN.
    PRIVATE 'PCN'? DON'T PAY BUT DON'T IGNORE IT (except N.Ireland).
    CLICK at the top of this/any page where it says:
    Forum Home»Motoring»Parking Tickets Fines & Parking - read the NEWBIES THREAD
  • fisherjim
    fisherjim Posts: 5,976
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    UKPC are idiots and scammers, I had one of their fake tickets last year, for parking slightly out of the box.
    It was followed up with their fake debt collection agency letters from both Debt recovery plus, and their other scam firm Zenith.
    I ignored all of them and they have stopped, after their threats, increases in charges and then their desperate letters offering a reduction if I pay, pretty please, beg beg!

    If their charges were legit why do they impersonate real parking tickets?
    They would only need to put an invoice on your screen send you a reminder and say you will pay it or else!
    But that's not what they do because it's just a moneymaking scam and they threaten and harass instead.
    Don't fall for it, and I'm sorry but the CAB are just as stupid, we had a posting about this before, and it seems that they have just lazily contacted the other scammers in the chain (the BPA) for advice.
  • I don't know if anyone on here is Au Fait with the regs for NI so as an addition post on the private parking section on pepipoo.com, they have a lot of people on there who should be able to help you.
    ps, Citizens Advice ALWAYS say pay up, its all they know.

    Thanks for the advice on pepipoo. Checked them out and you were right they do cover NI. A lot of other similar cases as mine.

    Thanks again :)
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