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    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 10:11 AM
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    lisyloo
    Visa chargeback scheme
    • #1
    • 5th Sep 17, 10:11 AM
    Visa chargeback scheme 5th Sep 17 at 10:11 AM
    Hello,


    I had to give up a "comfort" seat that I'd paid for on a flight when we were moved to a smaller aircraft.
    I have a hand-written offer of compensation plus full refund.
    I'm not getting any joy with EasyJet.
    I've taken this up with my bank as I paid via visa debit card.


    I am expecting them to be able to deal with the refund issue as we simply didn't get what we paid for.


    Does anyone know whether they'll deal with compensation if I have the offer in writing.
    I'm asking as it will affect the way I proceed.


    I have already sent 3 online complaints (1 of which I have chat transcript to show it was received) and 1 letter (signed for), but no response so far.


    Thankyou
    Last edited by lisyloo; 05-09-2017 at 10:16 AM.
Page 1
    • cono1717
    • By cono1717 5th Sep 17, 10:18 AM
    • 619 Posts
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    cono1717
    • #2
    • 5th Sep 17, 10:18 AM
    • #2
    • 5th Sep 17, 10:18 AM
    When you say a hand written offer was this something that easyjet has sent you in the post of via their chat?

    What are easyjet stating as the reason to not go along with their original offer?
    • agrinnall
    • By agrinnall 5th Sep 17, 10:59 AM
    • 18,437 Posts
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    agrinnall
    • #3
    • 5th Sep 17, 10:59 AM
    • #3
    • 5th Sep 17, 10:59 AM
    When you say a hand written offer was this something that easyjet has sent you in the post of via their chat?

    What are easyjet stating as the reason to not go along with their original offer?
    Originally posted by cono1717
    Or is the issue that you don't think the offer of compensation is high enough but Easyjet are refusing to negotiate with you?

    Regardless, I think your thread would be better placed on the Flight Delay Compensation sub board to Overseas Holidays (it deals with issues other than delays).
    Last edited by agrinnall; 05-09-2017 at 11:01 AM.
    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 11:04 AM
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    lisyloo
    • #4
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:04 AM
    • #4
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:04 AM
    When you say a hand written offer was this something that easyjet has sent you in the post of via their chat?

    What are easyjet stating as the reason to not go along with their original offer?
    Originally posted by cono1717

    The handwritten offer was given to me by the cabin manager (I have his name) onboard the flight. It details the offer, circumstances (moved to smaller plane) and the time of the phone call from the captain (named) and who (airports liason officer)/where (LGW) the phone call was made.
    I am assured the phone call would have been recorded.
    The paper is EasyJet branded on the back.
    Personally I think that's reasonably good evidence.


    I have not had any reason from EasyJet.
    There is a possibility that junior staff saw a compensation payment for delay and thought it had been dealt with but we are now at the "LETTER BEFORE ACTION" stage and I would expect someone to read it properly now and not get confused between the EU261 compensation for delay and something completely different.
    Last edited by lisyloo; 05-09-2017 at 11:08 AM.
    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 11:05 AM
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    lisyloo
    • #5
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:05 AM
    • #5
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:05 AM
    Or is the issue that you don't think the offer of compensation is high enough but Easyjet are refusing to negotiate with you?

    Regardless, I think your thread would be better placed on the Flight Delay Compensation sub board to Overseas Holidays (it deals with issues other than delays).
    Originally posted by agrinnall

    Not at all.
    The offer was made on board and put in writing.
    I am just expecting them to pay what they offered (and honestly disgusted that they haven't given that we co-operated and gave up a seat that we needed).


    My question was about the VISA chargeback scheme.
    i.e. can they deal with compensation (where it's a written offer and therefore binding) or can they only deal with refunds.
    Last edited by lisyloo; 05-09-2017 at 11:09 AM.
    • DoaM
    • By DoaM 5th Sep 17, 11:09 AM
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    DoaM
    • #6
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:09 AM
    • #6
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:09 AM
    How long ago did all this happen? How long have you been waiting for the refund/compensation?

    IMO (assuming the flight went ahead) you're not entitled to a full refund PLUS compensation - you're entitled to a refund of any additional premium you had paid for services not supplied. The cabin manager may not have had authority to make the offer he/she did ... I'd be careful about getting too 4rsey with Easyjet about this as they could easily withdraw/not honour that offer.
    Diary of a madman
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    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 11:48 AM
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    lisyloo
    • #7
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:48 AM
    • #7
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:48 AM
    How long ago did all this happen? How long have you been waiting for the refund/compensation?

    IMO (assuming the flight went ahead) you're not entitled to a full refund PLUS compensation - you're entitled to a refund of any additional premium you had paid for services not supplied. The cabin manager may not have had authority to make the offer he/she did ... I'd be careful about getting too 4rsey with Easyjet about this as they could easily withdraw/not honour that offer.
    Originally posted by DoaM

    The flight was 15/7.
    I emailed on 16/7 so 7.5 weeks. One of the reasons I wanted it dealt with quickly was to give them the opportunity to check the phone call whilst tapes available and also check with the crew whilst they still remembered what happened.
    The cabin manager made the offer after the captain spoke to the airports liason officer. I think if they make an offer that they should honour it and I happen to think a judge would agree.
    But anyways we certainly agree I'm entitled to the refund for service not received that they haven't made.


    What I'm asking is whether the VISA chargeback scheme covers compensation.


    I am not sure what you mean about 4rsey.
    I've written on-line and on paper and got no replies.
    As we agree they should refund (at least) for service not received then do you think it's acceptable to simply not reply?
    Using the visa chargeback scheme and or going to court is simply to get what they've offered.


    Again the simple question I'm asking is Does the VISA chargeback scheme cover compensation (in writing) or merely the refund.

    I am disappointed about the lack of support offered on here (not particularly what I came here for) after I co-operated and gave up a seat and stood or sat in discomfort for the flight through no fault of my own. I stood up for about 15 minutes and sat for about 30 on the flight attendants seat. Not that it matters but I am not the one causing the issue here, but I suffered discomfort because of this so that someone else could fly.


    Regardless of the rights and wrongs I think they should honour the offer they made. Personally I think it's generous, but they made it and they should honour it, surely or at the very least give a refund for services paid for but not received.
    Last edited by lisyloo; 05-09-2017 at 11:59 AM.
    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 11:52 AM
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    lisyloo
    • #8
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:52 AM
    Q2 - Visa Chargeback scheme
    • #8
    • 5th Sep 17, 11:52 AM
    Does anyone know whether the VISA chargeback scheme would cover a written offer of compensation of just refund for services not received.


    Giving details appears to hamper things.


    Many thanks
    • powerful_Rogue
    • By powerful_Rogue 5th Sep 17, 12:01 PM
    • 3,208 Posts
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    powerful_Rogue
    • #9
    • 5th Sep 17, 12:01 PM
    • #9
    • 5th Sep 17, 12:01 PM
    Please stick to just the one thread.
    http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?t=5705487

    Makes it overly confusing otherwise.
    • powerful_Rogue
    • By powerful_Rogue 5th Sep 17, 12:04 PM
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    powerful_Rogue
    The flight was 15/7.
    I emailed on 16/7 so 7.5 weeks. One of the reasons I wanted it dealt with quickly was to give them the opportunity to check the phone call whilst tapes available and also check with the crew whilst they still remembered what happened.
    The cabin manager made the offer after the captain spoke to the airports liason officer. I think if they make an offer that they should honour it and I happen to think a judge would agree.
    But anyways we certainly agree I'm entitled to the refund for service not received that they haven't made.


    What I'm asking is whether the VISA chargeback scheme covers compensation.


    I am not sure what you mean about 4rsey.
    I've written on-line and on paper and got no replies.
    As we agree they should refund (at least) for service not received then do you think it's acceptable to simply not reply?
    Using the visa chargeback scheme and or going to court is simply to get what they've offered.


    Again the simple question I'm asking is Does the VISA chargeback scheme cover compensation (in writing) or merely the refund.

    I am disappointed about the lack of support offered on here (not particularly what I came here for) after I co-operated and gave up a seat and stood or sat in discomfort for the flight through no fault of my own. I stood up for about 15 minutes and sat for about 30 on the flight attendants seat. Not that it matters but I am not the one causing the issue here, but I suffered discomfort because of this so that someone else could fly.


    Regardless of the rights and wrongs I think they should honour the offer they made. Personally I think it's generous, but they made it and they should honour it, surely or at the very least give a refund for services paid for but not received.
    Originally posted by lisyloo
    Disappointed by the lack of support on here? In which case,contact and a lawyer and see what they advise.

    1) How much was the flight?
    2) What is a "comfort" seat and how much did it cost you?
    3) How much did Easyjet offer you?
    • Caz3121
    • By Caz3121 5th Sep 17, 12:10 PM
    • 10,782 Posts
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    Caz3121
    I am assuming that a comfort seat is a second seat that you book in your name to give you 2 seats together but with the change to the smaller aircraft this was no longer an option so you had 1 seat instead of the 2 you paid for...is that correct?
    • p00hsticks
    • By p00hsticks 5th Sep 17, 12:19 PM
    • 5,593 Posts
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    p00hsticks
    Again the simple question I'm asking is Does the VISA chargeback scheme cover compensation (in writing) or merely the refund.
    Originally posted by lisyloo
    It's been a while since I worked in the card processing industry, but I'm pretty sure the answer is that a chargeback would only cover the refund of the original transaction (and in this case, just the extra premium you paid for the upgrade) as that is all that was put on the card in the first place. There's no leeway in the rules for compensation.

    FYI, if you want to look you can find the full visa rules here - chargebacks and dispute resolution are covered in section 11.
    https://www.visaeurope.com/media/images/visa%20public%20rules%2015%20october%202016-73-40575.pdf
    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 12:19 PM
    • 21,146 Posts
    • 10,138 Thanks
    lisyloo
    Disappointed by the lack of support on here? In which case,contact and a lawyer and see what they advise.

    1) How much was the flight?
    2) What is a "comfort" seat and how much did it cost you?
    3) How much did Easyjet offer you?
    Originally posted by powerful_Rogue

    I don't think the first is good advice (to pay for a lawyer).
    I will use moneyclaim online (£35) if I have to but would prefer to exhaust the chargeback scheme first as that is free.


    1) In total £444.44. I am asking for the 1 seat £98.49 plus seat reservation fee £3.99 (total £102.48) to be refunded i.e. just the bits they didn't provided.
    2) A comfort seat is for someone who needs more room. They could be disabled or fat for example, so they buy an extra seat. Sometimes couples (as in this case) buy 3 seats for 2 people and have one free in the middle. Not sure of the relevance. The fact is that we paid for something and didn't get it. The flight was £98.49 and the reservation fee for the seat we didn't get was £3.99. I'm not asking for the baggage elements or passenger duty, only a refund for the seat we didn't get.
    3) EasyJet offered a FULL refund for the seat plus E250 compensation IN WRITING.


    Do you know the answer to the question i.e. can VISA chargeback deal with compensation (agreed and in writing) or merely refunds for services not received.
    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 12:20 PM
    • 21,146 Posts
    • 10,138 Thanks
    lisyloo
    I am assuming that a comfort seat is a second seat that you book in your name to give you 2 seats together but with the change to the smaller aircraft this was no longer an option so you had 1 seat instead of the 2 you paid for...is that correct?
    Originally posted by Caz3121
    Correct.
    It was 2 seats instead of 3.
    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 12:21 PM
    • 21,146 Posts
    • 10,138 Thanks
    lisyloo
    It's been a while since I worked in the card processing industry, but I'm pretty sure the answer is that a chargeback would only cover the refund of the original transaction (and in this case, just the extra premium you paid for the upgrade) as that is all that was put on the card in the first place. There's no leeway in the rules for compensation.

    FYI, if you want to look you can find the full visa rules here - chargebacks and dispute resolution are covered in section 11.
    https://www.visaeurope.com/media/images/visa%20public%20rules%2015%20october%202016-73-40575.pdf
    Originally posted by p00hsticks

    Thanks very much.
    This is the information I was looking for.
    I was unsure once whether once an offer was made it because binding and a part of the transaction.
    Last edited by lisyloo; 05-09-2017 at 12:24 PM.
    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 12:23 PM
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    lisyloo
    I started the new thread to rephrase the question because unfortunately if you give some details then people go off on all sorts of tangeants asking about this and that when really I just had a question about the VISA chargeback scheme.
    Apologies if that caused you issues.
    • powerful_Rogue
    • By powerful_Rogue 5th Sep 17, 12:32 PM
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    powerful_Rogue
    I don't think the first is good advice (to pay for a lawyer).
    I will use moneyclaim online (£35) if I have to but would prefer to exhaust the chargeback scheme first as that is free.
    Originally posted by lisyloo
    It's good advice if you are not happy with the "lack of support" shown on this forum. If you want 100% correct and legal advice, then contact a lawyer.

    1) In total £444.44. I am asking for the 1 seat £98.49 plus seat reservation fee £3.99 (total £102.48) to be refunded i.e. just the bits they didn't provided.
    Originally posted by lisyloo
    Then £102.48 would be what you would claim for as that is your actual loss.

    2) A comfort seat is for someone who needs more room. They could be disabled or fat for example, so they buy an extra seat. Sometimes couples (as in this case) buy 3 seats for 2 people and have one free in the middle. Not sure of the relevance. The fact is that we paid for something and didn't get it. The flight was £98.49 and the reservation fee for the seat we didn't get was £3.99. I'm not asking for the baggage elements or passenger duty, only a refund for the seat we didn't get.
    Originally posted by lisyloo
    Because I have never heard of a comfort seat, so I simply asked what one was.


    Do you know the answer to the question i.e. can VISA chargeback deal with compensation (agreed and in writing) or merely refunds for services not received.
    Originally posted by lisyloo
    No.
    • lisyloo
    • By lisyloo 5th Sep 17, 12:50 PM
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    lisyloo
    It's good advice if you are not happy with the "lack of support" shown on this forum. If you want 100% correct and legal advice, then contact a lawyer.
    By lack of support I mean moral sympathy when I have acted morally to my own physical discomfort through no fault of my own and the other party have not acted honourably. Luckily I didn't come for that.

    I don't think it's good advice to go to a lawyer which involves paying a lot when

    a) I haven't exhausted the process with the retailer
    b) There is a free VISA chargeback scheme which will cover at least SOME of it
    c) moneyclaim online is £35


    Then £102.48 would be what you would claim for as that is your actual loss.
    Not sure if you mean specifically the chargeback scheme.
    I expect EasyJet to honour their offer which is £102.48 + E250.
    For chargeback I understand it may be limited to £102.48


    Because I have never heard of a comfort seat, so I simply asked what one was.
    No worries. It's polite terminology that companies use when they might be referring to someone who is clinically or morbidly obeise, although people might also use them if they had a disability that required them to stretch out or for a musical instrument. A "fat B@st@rd" seat might be more explanatory but they hardly call it call it that can they.

    Off topic but there is an issue which has been in the public domain about fat/tall people having trouble with airline seats.
    Long haul you can fly premium or business if you can afford it or get extra leg room.
    Ironically if you are obeise you can often not avail yourself of the extra legroom seat around the exits because safety rule (rightly) dictate that an obeise passenger may be a hazard around an exit (for example unconscious).
    On short haul flights you can often not get premium seats so the only option is to buy two. Whatever the rights and wrongs of someone's size (and tall people have issue too) then I believe it's far better for that person to buy two seats than to crush the person in the adjoining seats.
    FWIW - I am a crushee not a crusher.


    I was crushed on the EasyJet flight and also stood for some of it and sat in the flight assistants seat away from the convenience of my books, drinks etc.
    That is why I think morally I should be compensated.
    Legally and morally I think they should pay it because THEY OFERRED IT and I don't they will be able to walk away from this written offer.
    I might come back and let you know as in general I value this helpful and friendly community.
    Last edited by lisyloo; 05-09-2017 at 1:06 PM.
    • powerful_Rogue
    • By powerful_Rogue 5th Sep 17, 1:05 PM
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    powerful_Rogue
    By lack of support I mean moral sympathy when I have acted morally to my own physical discomfort through no fault of my own and the other party have not acted honourably. Luckily I didn't come for that.
    Originally posted by lisyloo
    But this is a consumer rights board. I don't know why you would expect moral sympathy on here, and the fact you say you didn't come looking for it, then I can't see why you have raised the issue as you haven't got any.

    I don't think it's good advice to go to a lawyer which involves paying a lot when

    a) I haven't exhausted the process with the retailer
    b) There is a free VISA chargeback scheme which will cover at least SOME of it
    c) moneyclaim online is £35
    Originally posted by lisyloo
    When you said "lack of support", I thought you meant answers you wanted. That's why I suggested a lawyer. You've cleared that up RE: moral sympathy.

    Not sure if you mean specifically the chargeback scheme.
    I expect EasyJet to honour their offer which is £102.48 + E250.
    For chargeback I understand it may be limited to £102.48
    Originally posted by lisyloo
    Chargeback will be for £102.48
    • KeithP
    • By KeithP 5th Sep 17, 1:16 PM
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    KeithP
    You have asked us many times whether a chargeback is appropriate.

    I am really struggling to understand why you haven't asked your card issuer that question.

    Seek a chargeback from your card issuer.
    Reason = promised refund not materialised.
    .
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