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    • Flugelhorn
    • By Flugelhorn 26th Dec 17, 11:33 AM
    • 610Posts
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    Flugelhorn
    Care Agency agreement process
    • #1
    • 26th Dec 17, 11:33 AM
    Care Agency agreement process 26th Dec 17 at 11:33 AM
    Have been phoned by an agency who are going to be providing care for a relative - they listed all the things they have been asked to do and said "is that OK with you" .. and basically they want the money, though they didn't give any indication of the cost of any of it!

    I currently am registering LPA and have no idea how much money there is available to pay for all this.

    Should I get some sort of written contract from them??
Page 1
    • BorisThomson
    • By BorisThomson 26th Dec 17, 11:45 AM
    • 746 Posts
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    BorisThomson
    • #2
    • 26th Dec 17, 11:45 AM
    • #2
    • 26th Dec 17, 11:45 AM
    How can they want the money if you don't know how much it costs? Have you asked for a written agreement?
    • missile
    • By missile 26th Dec 17, 1:09 PM
    • 9,131 Posts
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    missile
    • #3
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:09 PM
    • #3
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:09 PM
    who are going to be providing care for a relative
    Who arranged this? Has your relative been assessed for care need?

    Ask for an itemised estimate
    "A nation's greatness is measured by how it treats its weakest members." ~ Mahatma Gandhi
    Ride hard or stay home
    • Flugelhorn
    • By Flugelhorn 26th Dec 17, 1:12 PM
    • 610 Posts
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    Flugelhorn
    • #4
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:12 PM
    • #4
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:12 PM
    How can they want the money if you don't know how much it costs? Have you asked for a written agreement?
    Originally posted by BorisThomson
    Didn't get a chance - haven't agreed to anything yet, next time I speak to them am going to get something in writing. I just kept pointing out that I had no idea re finances yet

    One of those ghastly moments when you get phoned when you least expect it and think of all the things you should have said afterwards.
    • elsien
    • By elsien 26th Dec 17, 1:16 PM
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    elsien
    • #5
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:16 PM
    • #5
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:16 PM
    When say you don't have a choice, who has arranged it? If it's the local authority then there should be a financial assessment with regards to self funding.
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • Flugelhorn
    • By Flugelhorn 26th Dec 17, 1:40 PM
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    Flugelhorn
    • #6
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:40 PM
    • #6
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:40 PM
    When say you don't have a choice, who has arranged it? If it's the local authority then there should be a financial assessment with regards to self funding.
    Originally posted by elsien
    It was no chance, not no choice (though felt like no choice either - fortunately digging heels in is one of my specialties)

    LA have been involved, have it in their heads that relative is self funding but can't find out where they got that info from.. how long does financial assessment take?
    • elsien
    • By elsien 26th Dec 17, 1:49 PM
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    elsien
    • #7
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:49 PM
    • #7
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:49 PM
    https://www.moneyadviceservice.org.uk/en/articles/means-tests-for-help-with-care-costs-how-they-work

    This time of year, probably not that quickly. Or it could just be very obvious that relative will be a self funded - see above link. But with my grandmother, once the LA had decided she was self funding we got given a list of agencies and were told to get on with it. So I'm surprised that one is in place without you being involved.

    Echoing the previous question though, has relative had a needs assessment to work out how much help should be going in?

    If in doubt, contact the named social worker, or in the more likely event that there isn't one, try the duty team.
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • Flugelhorn
    • By Flugelhorn 26th Dec 17, 1:52 PM
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    Flugelhorn
    • #8
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:52 PM
    • #8
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:52 PM
    Thanks - I think that is the bit that I don't get, somehow they have organised it without input. Will speak to the social worker later this week and see what is going on - Need to be forearmed before care agency start bending my words
    • elsien
    • By elsien 26th Dec 17, 1:59 PM
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    elsien
    • #9
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:59 PM
    • #9
    • 26th Dec 17, 1:59 PM
    You might want to google some information on Care Act assessments then, starting with how they ensured your relative was meaningfully involved (which is a legislative requirement, whether they have capacity or not.)
    All shall be well, and all shall be well, and all manner of things shall be well.

    Pedant alert - it's could have, not could of.
    • crv1963
    • By crv1963 31st Dec 17, 9:52 PM
    • 192 Posts
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    crv1963
    There needs to be two assessments-


    1) Needs assessment- what needs have to be met and by whom?


    then


    2) A financial assessment- who pays or is it all self funded?


    If the person requiring the care doesn't have capacity to make the decision on 1 and 2 then there needs to be a separate Capacity Assessment and it needs to be identified who can help deciding if there is not sufficient evidence of capacity.


    For example I may know and be able to agree I need help washing and dressing but I may not be able to decide how I will pay for the care need to be met.


    Also bear in mind if it is all health related then there may be a duty for the local CCG to contribute towards the cost, or even meet the full costs but it is unlikely these will be met unless directly asked for. Also if the person needing care has ever been detained under the Mental Health Act for treatment then it is likely the NHS is liable for at least 50% of the care costs again probably needs direct asking as opposed to it being offered!
    CRV1963- Light bulb moment Sept 15- Planning the great escape- aka retirement!
    • crv1963
    • By crv1963 31st Dec 17, 10:00 PM
    • 192 Posts
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    crv1963
    [QUOTE=elsien;73616831]https://www.moneyadviceservice.org.uk/en/articles/means-tests-for-help-with-care-costs-how-they-work

    This time of year, probably not that quickly. QUOTE]


    There is a duty of care- the more urgent the need the faster the expected response time. If the person needing care is blocking an NHS hospital bed then the assessment should happen before discharge, likewise if the assessment needs to be done to prevent an admission it needs to be done quickly to prevent this or further deterioration.
    CRV1963- Light bulb moment Sept 15- Planning the great escape- aka retirement!
    • northwest1965
    • By northwest1965 1st Jan 18, 5:54 PM
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    northwest1965
    You also need to check out the care agency for yourself. Make sure that they are good. Will it be the same person attending?
    Before they do anything, they should come out and discuss things with you and the person needing the care
    Loved our trip to the West Coast USA. Death Valley is the place to go!
    • Flugelhorn
    • By Flugelhorn 3rd Jan 18, 5:13 PM
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    Flugelhorn
    Thanks all - it has only been some brief chats on the phone up until now. Good idea re checking on the agency - feels a bit like a done deal at the moment and I need to make sure that all the things that should have been done have actually been done
    • crv1963
    • By crv1963 3rd Jan 18, 6:50 PM
    • 192 Posts
    • 502 Thanks
    crv1963
    Thanks all - it has only been some brief chats on the phone up until now. Good idea re checking on the agency - feels a bit like a done deal at the moment and I need to make sure that all the things that should have been done have actually been done
    Originally posted by Flugelhorn




    No, there is no such thing as a done deal, especially if it is self funded, care agencies/ providers can and are changed. I'd want to know who agreed the package, to see the assessment (all this will be recorded in the patient/ user/ client notes) and the authorisation.
    CRV1963- Light bulb moment Sept 15- Planning the great escape- aka retirement!
    • Mojisola
    • By Mojisola 3rd Jan 18, 9:27 PM
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    Mojisola
    feels a bit like a done deal at the moment
    Originally posted by Flugelhorn
    No, there is no such thing as a done deal, especially if it is self funded
    Originally posted by crv1963
    Absolutely - a service is being bought in and the company providing it can be changed if the service doesn't suit.

    I chose a fairly small company when I arranged care for Mum and Dad and the carers became very well known to them instead of them never knowing who was going to arrive each day.
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