MSE News: Welfare reforms 'to hit disabled'
Comments
-
Describing something as a "gravy train" doesn't necessarily imply fraud.
Indeed it doesn't but a recent poster saying he receives £1100 a month on disability benefits as opposed to the ~£300 he would get on JSA would seem to show why people are anxious to stay on disability benefits.0 -
rogerblack wrote: »Despite government ministers who would dearly love to be able to say 'Fraud is 30% of disability benefit payouts' - DWP research based on checking up in detail on a random set of claimants found it to be around 0.5%.
The continued spinning against the disabled by ministers has been very obvious, often coming not much short of flat-out-lying.
Statements like 'Only 7% of claimants to ESA are found to be unable to do any work' - implying that 93% are workshy scroungers.
When the reality is that ESA is claimed for periods as short as a week, for short-term injuries and illnesses.
Someone claiming with a broken leg will never get to the 13 week assessment, so will never be 'found unfit for work'.
It also neglects that you can be found 'sort-of-fit-for-some-work.'
People in this position are often severely disabled - and yet the assumption that they can work if they try has been used to justify everything from housing benefit cuts to time-limiting ESA.
The real figure if you go through all the problems with the '7%' figure is closer to 70%.
(assuming everyone had representation to properly put their case to the tribunal, and to assist them through the process).
It's also important to realise that the remaining 30% are often quite disabled.
Simply being found fit for work doesn't mean you are.
This sort of spinning has been directly linked to the rise on attacks on disabled people.
Which means that 93% can do (or will be able to do in the future) SOME work, which means they will be put in the work-related activity group of ESA rather than the support group . It does not suggest that they are fully fit for all types of work at this very moment.(AKA HRH_MUngo)
Member #10 of £2 savers club
Imagine someone holding forth on biology whose only knowledge of the subject is the Book of British Birds, and you have a rough idea of what it feels like to read Richard Dawkins on theology: Terry Eagleton0 -
Yet the implication is, in all honesty, quite clear, so why the pretence. The upshot is that support for those with disability is a drain on finance and resources, that's a fact.
There's an enormous difference between questioning the culture of benefits and the assumption of fraud.0 -
seven-day-weekend wrote: »Which means that 93% can do (or will be able to do in the future) SOME work. It does not suggest that they are fully fit for all types of work at this very moment.
Quite.
However, that was very different from the way it was spun to the national papers at the time.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/news/article-2018941/Only-7-claiming-Incapacity-Benefit-replacement-unfit-work-claims-DWP.html0 -
seven-day-weekend wrote: »Which means that 93% can do (or will be able to do in the future) SOME work. It does not suggest that they are fully fit for all types of work at this very moment.
Quite.
However, that was very different from the way it was spun to the national papers at the time.
"Only 7% of those claiming Incapacity Benefit replacement are unfit for work, claims DWP
Only one in 14 of those trying to claim the replacement for incapacity benefit are actually unfit for work, Government figures have revealed.
"
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/news/article-2018941/Only-7-claiming-Incapacity-Benefit-replacement-unfit-work-claims-DWP.html
(This article has been considerably updated from its original state, which was much more negative)0 -
krisskross wrote: »Reading some of the amounts claimed via disability real and exaggerated I would suggest that to many people it is a Disability Gravy train.
And if we're all in it together why is it that it's only the disabled that are being punished.
If you're a member of parliament you can claim much more for first class rail travel (even if you don't pay it) and you can have expensive rents paid.Liverpool is one of the wonders of Britain,
What it may grow to in time, I know not what.
Daniel Defoe: 1725.
0 -
For some it is not the loss of the money they get from DLA that will be the problem, it is the other help options and benefits that come with it.
For instance, I get a free parking space at work as I am 'registered disabled'. I can't use public transport as I'm unable to sit or stand for more than an hour and a half at a time (which is how long to takes on 2 buses to and from work), but driving is more expensive (more than twice the cost of public transport) and so the free parking space is a means for me to mitigate that extra cost.
However, I only get that space as I am registered disabled. We all know there is no disabled register and what they actually mean is that I receive DLA.
There are many other options for help out there that are only given on production of proof that you are disabled, which in 99% of cases is proof that you are in receipt of DLA.
For example the Disabled persons bus pass- only issued on proof of receiveing DLA/AA.
There is a suspicion that those who can self propel in a wheelchair will not get the new PIP which replaces DLA from next year.
Does this mean a wheelchair bound person who can self propel, but does not satisfy the PIP criteria is not disabled?
Why should a person who is disabled, but does not qualify for the benefit, or choses not to claim the benefit, be discriminated against when it comes to these other forms of help.
Thats why I suggested there needs to be another way of being 'registered disabled' a few months ago on this forum, in order for all disabled people to be entitled to the further help that is available.[SIZE=-1]To equate judgement and wisdom with occupation is at best . . . insulting.
[/SIZE]0 -
And if we're all in it together why is it that it's only the disabled that are being punished.
If you're a member of parliament you can claim much more for first class rail travel (even if you don't pay it) and you can have expensive rents paid.
It's not. It's also the under 25s, under 35s, social housing tenants on Housing Benefit who have a spare room, and various others. Most people on benefits in fact, unless they have hoards of children or, (dare I say it) are Pensioners.
How else is the Welfare bill going to come down unless the way we dish it out is curtailed?(AKA HRH_MUngo)
Member #10 of £2 savers club
Imagine someone holding forth on biology whose only knowledge of the subject is the Book of British Birds, and you have a rough idea of what it feels like to read Richard Dawkins on theology: Terry Eagleton0 -
krisskross wrote: »Indeed it doesn't but a recent poster saying he receives £1100 a month on disability benefits as opposed to the ~£300 he would get on JSA would seem to show why people are anxious to stay on disability benefits.
But if he receives DLA then if he applied for JSA instead of ESA he would receive £1100 a month minus the difference between JSA and ESA (if any), so, would receive, what? £1100?0 -
For some it is not the loss of the money they get from DLA that will be the problem, it is the other help options and benefits that come with it.
For instance, I get a free parking space at work as I am 'registered disabled'. I can't use public transport as I'm unable to sit or stand for more than an hour and a half at a time (which is how long to takes on 2 buses to and from work), but driving is more expensive (more than twice the cost of public transport) and so the free parking space is a means for me to mitigate that extra cost.
However, I only get that space as I am registered disabled. We all know there is no disabled register and what they actually mean is that I receive DLA.
There are many other options for help out there that are only given on production of proof that you are disabled, which in 99% of cases is proof that you are in receipt of DLA.
For example the Disabled persons bus pass- only issued on proof of receiveing DLA/AA.
There is a suspicion that those who can self propel in a wheelchair will not get the new PIP which replaces DLA from next year.
Does this mean a wheelchair bound person who can self propel, but does not satisfy the PIP criteria is not disabled?
Why should a person who is disabled, but does not qualify for the benefit, or choses not to claim the benefit, be discriminated against when it comes to these other forms of help.
Thats why I suggested there needs to be another way of being 'registered disabled' a few months ago on this forum, in order for all disabled people to be entitled to the further help that is available.
I couldn't agree more. That's the sort of help disabled people really need rather than simply having money thrown at them.0
This discussion has been closed.
Categories
- All Categories
- 343.1K Banking & Borrowing
- 250.1K Reduce Debt & Boost Income
- 449.7K Spending & Discounts
- 235.2K Work, Benefits & Business
- 607.9K Mortgages, Homes & Bills
- 173K Life & Family
- 247.8K Travel & Transport
- 1.5M Hobbies & Leisure
- 15.9K Discuss & Feedback
- 15.1K Coronavirus Support Boards