Red Debt Collection (Lowells) & 3 mobile

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  • Hello all, I have signed up to Money Saving Expert today to share my experience on this whole ordeal in hope it might help somebody and cause them less frustration than it has caused me this evening.

    I came home after a long days work, to find a debt recovery letter from Red Debt Collection Services. I was surprised to say the least and initially, I was going to ignore it - but the outstanding balance rang a bell and it was just too much of a coincidence to sweep aside. SO I began investigating. Like yourselves, sheff71 and pete1909 - I too, took out a contract with 3G Network many years ago (back in 2005 and coincidentally it was with the Carphone Warehouse), and remember disputing a bill of about £40 (£41.32 to be precise).

    So I got on the phone to 3G immediately, only to be put through to somebody in India. Immediately I thought, “oh here we go” and after much ranting and raving, I got absolutely no where. What I did find, was that they still had all my details on file (rather worrying) and that they acknowledged a debt of £41.32. I was absolutely astonished by this, as I had never received anything from them requesting this amount other than that one occasion where I thought it had all been settled. I went on to request further details of this debt, only to be told they had no access to it and I would need to contact Red Debt Collection Services in order to clear this balance. I asked how they could pass this on to debt collectors before giving me any sort of written warning, Vidya (the lady from India) had no response to this other than “Well Mr. Singh, I can confirm we sent you a text message in February 2006 stating there is an outstanding balance on your account”. Now this really got me fired up for a couple of reasons:

    1. Considering they have all my home details on file, why not just write to me requesting this amount?
    2. The text was sent after I had my contract cancelled with them – leaving no way for me to receive said message.

    So there I am, ranting and raving down the phone to this poor girl demanding I speak to a supervisor when she quietly tells me the most important thing in solving this whole mystery…

    Apparently, the account was transferred around the time of the outstanding balance. I asked who to? She put me on hold for a moment, to come back with the reply “Carphone Warehouse”. That’s when it hit me. I had taken out an insurance policy on my handset through the Carphone Warehouse which allowed me to end my contract early with no come backs (or so I thought). I am not sure if they still offer this policy or not, but it basically allowed me to cancel the contract at any point within the 18 months and all I had to do was give back the sim card and handset.

    I immediately got on the phone to Carphone Warehouse Lifeline (the insurance company) and explained the situation. Within seconds they gave me a solution: Simply go to my nearest Carphone Warehouse branch, with a copy of the debt collection letter and I will be refunded the full amount. The chap on the line was most useful, he acknowledged the amount that was outstanding and advised there may have been a mixup between themselves and 3G and they’ll have it settled right away. It’s as simple as that.

    I have just bit the bullet and paid the collection company in good faith that I will receive my refund from Carphone Warehouse. It is safe to say this is a legitimate claim – atleast in my case – and I hope this has been of use to somebody out there.

    Also, don’t ring their over charging 0844/0870 numbers, please find below the numbers I rang to get this mess sorted out.

    3g Network 01442 456195
    Carphone Warehouse Lifeline 02087 538111
    Red Debt Collection 01133 086000

    After speaking with the advisor from Red Debt Collection, he told me they have recently taken on over 250,000 cases from 3G – which is quite astonishing. One thing is for sure,.. it is not the last we hear about this.
  • rog2
    rog2 Posts: 11,650
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    reshocked wrote: »
    I immediately got on the phone to Carphone Warehouse Lifeline (the insurance company) and explained the situation. Within seconds they gave me a solution: Simply go to my nearest Carphone Warehouse branch, with a copy of the debt collection letter and I will be refunded the full amount. The chap on the line was most useful, he acknowledged the amount that was outstanding and advised there may have been a mixup between themselves and 3G and they’ll have it settled right away. It’s as simple as that.
    After speaking with the advisor from Red Debt Collection, he told me they have recently taken on over 250,000 cases from 3G – which is quite astonishing.

    Wow - what a way to have to go to get to the bottom of things - incredible.

    A couple of things that 'set the alarm bells ringing:
    • Carphone Warehouse - I kind of suspected that their name would come up sooner or later - why am I not surprised? :confused:
    • How on earth can 250,000 similar cases have been allowed to find themselves in the clutches of a 'greed driven' company like Red Debt Collection?
    I find it almost incredible that you have had to actually 'pay' these vultures against the 'promise' of a refund from Carphone !!!!!house. :rolleyes:
    I am NOT, nor do I profess to be, a Qualified Debt Adviser. I have made MANY mistakes and have OFTEN been the unwitting victim of the the shamefull tactics of the Financial Industry.
    If any of my experiences, or the knowledge that I have gained from those experiences, can help anyone who finds themselves in similar circumstances, then my experiences have not been in vain.

    HMRC Bankruptcy Statistic - 26th October 2006 - 23rd April 2007 BCSC Member No. 7

    DFW Nerd # 166 PROUD TO BE DEALING WITH MY DEBTS
  • I have also recieved a letter from these people about a small amount owing on a "3G mobile" account from years ago. I'm sure I had a finished and paid up contract so I logged onto this forum to have a look. Something does not look right about the letter anyway. Normally a DCA will send a letter simply asking to contact them so that they can help, all friendly like to get you to call.
    I also think the the account should have been called "3Mobile" and not "3G mobile" as this refers to a type of mobile services provided by all the major players.

    Merlyn2003's earlier post claims the company is in liquidation!!
    I am guessing that somone has stolen the identity of this company and they are using it to fraudulently collect money from people.
    I fully intend to investigate and post my findings here.

    *:exclamati DO NOT CONTACT RED BY PHONE AND DO NOT PAY THEM ANYTHING:exclamati*

    It is vitally important that you do not give these illegal PHISHERS any information. I know of a friend who recieved a DCA letter relating to an unpaid gas bill at his address from before he moved in. He lives on an ex-airbase and there is NO GAS SUPPLY. He was nieve and phoned them to explain he didn't owe them anything but they sent him a letter a few weeks later asking for the same amount but for electricity and after the date he moved in!! This matter was resolved when I advised him to insist, in writing, for a copy of the original bill. He hasn't heard from them since.
  • fermi
    fermi Posts: 40,546
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    Merlyn2003's earlier post claims the company is in liquidation!!
    I am guessing that somone has stolen the identity of this company and they are using it to fraudulently collect money from people.
    I fully intend to investigate and post my findings here.

    No. I think you will find that Merlyn2003 has retrieved the wrong record from companies house. The name is similar, but it is not a company linked with the Lowell group and is not the Red Collections referred to here.

    Red Collections is simply a "trading style" of the Lowell Group.
    Free/impartial debt advice: National Debtline | StepChange Debt Charity | Find your local CAB

    IVA & fee charging DMP companies: Profits from misery, motivated ONLY by greed
  • The cpmmon factors appear to be 3G mobiles that didnt work that were purchased from carphone warehouse.

    The debts were wiped clean, as is shown in mine and several others credit reports.


    Then now 4-5 years later phone calls, and visits from Red debt collectors.

    I am tempted to take it to court, but I am not sure I have the time or the inclination.

    But I am furious at the audacity of 3.

    In my case ofcom ruled against them and told them to cancel the contract and wipe the debt? Do they think a court is going to rule in their favour?
  • Hi
    Received Red Debt Collection letter yesterday for the following:

    Original creditor: 3G Mobile.
    Balance outstanding £19.20

    First reaction was to phone 3. I have been with them for years, pay by direct debit and did not recall any debt owing. The lady in India could not find any records of any outstanding amounts. I then tried to phone Red but became suspicious when answer service kept kicking in to leave contact details so looked them up on net and very glad I found these posts.

    Having read all the posts should I ignore it for now or send a recorded letter asking them for the original invoice?

    thanks
  • LunarTic
    LunarTic Posts: 27 Forumite
    Another one! They must really be on a mission, we're currently dealing with a demand from Red/Lowell concerning an alleged debt on a one2one/T-Mobile contract my wife had over 6 years ago. In our case, knowing that my wife has never been contacted regarding any debt on this account until the RED letter, we are confident of this particular debt (if it actually exists) being "Statute Barred" under the Limitation Act 1980 Section 5, http://www.nationaldebtline.co.uk/england_wales/factsheet.php?page=25_liability_for_debts_and_the_limitation_act and so we have written to them stating as such.

    I recommend to ignore Red Debt Collection/Lowell Portfolio I et al, and send a Subject Access Request under the Data Protection Act to 3, such that they provide documentary evidence of the alleged debt. Even then it's probably not worth it, as companies can charge up to £10 to provide information when challenged with a Subject Access Request and that's more than half the alleged debt of £19.20 - but if you think it's worth it as a matter of principle then I'd go for it anyway.

    According to the Guardian, http://www.guardian.co.uk/money/2008/aug/02/consumeraffairs it would appear that debt companies such as Lowell would pay around 0.5p per £1.00 of debt owed, so 200 times less than the original debt - meaning that it would have cost them just under 10p to buy a debt worth £19.20!

    But who would want to go to such an effort to retrieve the paltry sum of £19.20? Although, so saying, it could be highly amusing to see how long you can string this out, as when you factor in the amount of time and money taken to deal with the claim (even at the minimum wage), postage costs, stationery costs, etc, it may well cost Lowell more to pursue the debt than they would likely gain if it were paid anyway.

    You may wish to be aware of the Office of Fair Trading's guidelines on debt collection, http://www.oft.gov.uk/advice_and_resources/resource_base/legal/cca/debt-collection in case you have any reason to suspect that any of these guidelines may have been broken concerning your case.
  • rog2
    rog2 Posts: 11,650
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    LunarTic wrote: »
    But who would want to go to such an effort to retrieve the paltry sum of £19.20?

    That, Lunar, is exactly why Lowell are going through this excercise. They know that the majority of people are going to be 'frightened' into paying up when they receive their letter. We have only seen half a dozen, if that, cases of this 'scam' (and make no mistake, that is what it boils down to) on this forum. How many thousands of letters have the low-life of Lowell sent out? They can afford to 'lose out' on a dozen or even more, but, whatever way you look at it, it remains a 'nice little earner' for them.
    I am NOT, nor do I profess to be, a Qualified Debt Adviser. I have made MANY mistakes and have OFTEN been the unwitting victim of the the shamefull tactics of the Financial Industry.
    If any of my experiences, or the knowledge that I have gained from those experiences, can help anyone who finds themselves in similar circumstances, then my experiences have not been in vain.

    HMRC Bankruptcy Statistic - 26th October 2006 - 23rd April 2007 BCSC Member No. 7

    DFW Nerd # 166 PROUD TO BE DEALING WITH MY DEBTS
  • LunarTic
    LunarTic Posts: 27 Forumite
    Aye, and even more so when they get a 20,000% return on their "investment" (assuming the figures quoted in the Guardian). So even if they only secured payment on half of the debts, that would still mean them getting 100 times more back than what they had paid for the debts in the first place! And they would only need to successfully chase up 1 in 200 debts to break even! [assuming that the amount of debt is on average split equally between debtors]

    Thankfully I'm too honest to want to go into such a business - I know it would be easy money, but it would weigh on my conscience. I'd much rather make an honest living doing IT!
  • I too received a letter from them stating I owe £20.84p to 3G.

    I did have a 3G mobile phone about 5 years ago, and used to pay my bills in full by direct debit and my bills were regularly over £100 per month so not paying 20.84 sounds very odd?

    I queried it with them, they said they would investigate. About a week later I recieve a letter offering a 70% reduction. Which is only £6.25, however for me its a matter of principle. So I am sending them a letter telling them to get lost, and I wont pay a penny that I dont owe. Clearly these companies prey on people who might take their offer of a reduced rate even if they dont owe anything?

    I always !!!! companies off by making a subject access request under Section 7 of the Data Protection Act 1998 requesting all information held in relation to my account, membership, transcripts of telephone conversations as well as actual recordings of telephone conversations (if held).

    Companies can charge £10 for this info, but have 40 days in which to comply. Failure to comply will hold them in breach of the DPAct. Quite often companies may find it will be less hassle to stop their harrassment then locate and forward people the info.

    Stick it out and dont pay them a penny - until it is absolutecly undeniable that you do indeed owe this money.
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