Second hand car problem - Help Please.

[jdfallon1970]

Hi,

I would like some advice (if possible) about a second hand car I recently purchased from a company via ebay - I picked it up in person and paid cash and only a small deposit that i paid via Paypal.

I bought the car about 3 weeks ago. And was told that the engine had no leaks, that the tyres and brakes were all good and that there were no engine noises. About a week after I bought it i had it serviced and the following problems were highlighted.



3 of the tyres were so bad that if stopped I would have got 3 points for each.
A possible leak in the oil was highlighted but there was no certainty and i was told to keep an eye on it.
The brake pads are almost worn out.
There is a cracked exhaust head that is creating a noise.
After about another week I went on holiday on the way home the engine cut out. The electric warning light came on. I was then able to restart the car but the light stayed on. I have now booked it into the garage as the engine cuts out after 5/6 miles and I have to restart. There is also evidence that there is in fact an oil leak.

I noticed the following on this site:

"Second hand cars specifically.

If buying from a trader your rights are the same as always. However certain factors must be taken into account. A car should be fit to use on the road, be in a condition that effects its age and price and be reasonably reliable. ‘Sold as seen' has no basis in law, your sale of goods act rights still apply.

Note private sellers of cars works like all second hand private sales (see above) however unless stated you have a right to expect the car will pass an MOT."

The car was not initially fit for use on the road because of the tyres and is clearly not reliable. Although I bought this from a company they might argue that it is a private ebay seller (although they state they are a company on the ebay listing) but it would still not have passed an MOT.

I have contacted the company about the tyres (not the leak yet - I am waiting to see the cost) but they have not got back to me. Also the MOT is due in a few weeks should I wait and see if there are any further problems.

I have only done about 400 miles in this car (athough it was described as doing a 1000 less than it actually had)

Any advice would be welcome. Thanks for your time.

On a seperate ebay note. They have put in a unpaid dispute claim with ebay and emailed me to ask if I would accept so they could get their fee's back. I do have a receipt though.

[Hintza]

You will need to approach them and point out the faults and they will possibly/probably be liable to repair at least some of them.

The problem I have is what checks did you do yourself? Three dodgy tyres indicates you made no inspection of the car whatsoever.

If the faults were pointed out uou will have less reason to have a claim.

But I am sure someone with more knowledge will be along shortly.

[Miss_Marple]

Do you mean that although you've paid, they want you to say that you haven't so that they can get fees back ? I would not accept the dispute, especially if they have not provided you with a road worthy car.

Not sure how eBay would feel about that either - I'm sure it would get them banned. Why should you have a dispute against you just so that they can get back the fees they knew they were going have to pay (apologies if I've misunderstood)

[jdfallon1970]

Thanks for your replies:

Hintza - No i did not have any checks done by myself (I know nothing about cars) or anyone else. As they are a company and the tyres were described as being in a good state I presumed that they were telling the truth and that good state meant they were road worthy.

Miss-marple - No you understand correctly.

Thanks again.

[anewman]

Supposedly there is some law against selling an unroadworthy car which it sounds like on the strength of the tyres.

*BUT* the law states it's the driver's responsibility to check the condition of the car, so it's up to you to check the tyres before driving. I would have checked before handing over cash and if it was not as described I'd have walked away with the cash and taken the negative feedback, made a constructive reply to it and give them negative feedback in return.

You accepted the car and handed over cash unfortunately. As you've now done 400 miles - if I was the seller I'd probably argue it was subsequent wear and tear.

[Conor]

No way I'd buy a car from Ebay unless it was a rare classic and even then only after inspecting it first prior to bidding. Ebay is where everyone sells rubbish.

[Inactive]

No way I'd buy a car from Ebay unless it was a rare classic and even then only after inspecting it first prior to bidding. Ebay is where everyone sells rubbish.


That is a very sweeping statement that is utter rubbish itself Conor.

As with any vehicle purchase, the buyer needs to be aware, eBay is no different to anywhere else in that respect.

[Conor]

Ebay is very different because for some reason, people seem to think that the normal rules of buying a car - GO LOOK AT IT FIRST - don't apply. Apart from some specialist stuff, its mostly filled with stuff people can't shift by the normal means or they know has problems.

Regarding Ebay, it's an auction. If you buy from a regular auction it's sold as seen and the rules on second hand car sales don't apply.

[Hintza]

I agree with you in one respect Conor in that folk think the normal cat buying rules fail to apply. But it is just the same as buying via say the local paper.

But with the local paper you have the bare minimum in description you wander round and check it it out. If it meets your needs you buy it.

Whilst on the other hand on EBay seller gives a full description of the car (again you really should view it) you ask questions and hopefully make a decision. However if you then go to collect the car and the seller has spouted a load of nonsense or left out some detail you just say thanks but no thanks.

[inmypocketnottheirs]

The Sale of Goods Act still applies. The goods should be of merchantable quality and free of material defect. If this is not the case then the buyer has protection.

Contact your local Trading Standards and get them involved. Also have a look at www.consumerdirect.gov.uk (http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk)

HTH

[cyclonebri1]

Hi,

I would like some advice (if possible) about a second hand car I recently purchased from a company via ebay - I picked it up in person and paid cash and only a small deposit that i paid via Paypal.

I bought the car about 3 weeks ago. And was told that the engine had no leaks, that the tyres and brakes were all good and that there were no engine noises. About a week after I bought it i had it serviced and the following problems were highlighted.


3 of the tyres were so bad that if stopped I would have got 3 points for each.
A possible leak in the oil was highlighted but there was no certainty and i was told to keep an eye on it.
The brake pads are almost worn out.
There is a cracked exhaust head that is creating a noise.After about another week I went on holiday on the way home the engine cut out. The electric warning light came on. I was then able to restart the car but the light stayed on. I have now booked it into the garage as the engine cuts out after 5/6 miles and I have to restart. There is also evidence that there is in fact an oil leak.

I noticed the following on this site:

"Second hand cars specifically.

If buying from a trader your rights are the same as always. However certain factors must be taken into account. A car should be fit to use on the road, be in a condition that effects its age and price and be reasonably reliable. ‘Sold as seen' has no basis in law, your sale of goods act rights still apply.

Note private sellers of cars works like all second hand private sales (see above) however unless stated you have a right to expect the car will pass an MOT."

The car was not initially fit for use on the road because of the tyres and is clearly not reliable. Although I bought this from a company they might argue that it is a private ebay seller (although they state they are a company on the ebay listing) but it would still not have passed an MOT.

I have contacted the company about the tyres (not the leak yet - I am waiting to see the cost) but they have not got back to me. Also the MOT is due in a few weeks should I wait and see if there are any further problems.

I have only done about 400 miles in this car (athough it was described as doing a 1000 less than it actually had)

Any advice would be welcome. Thanks for your time.

On a seperate ebay note. They have put in a unpaid dispute claim with ebay and emailed me to ask if I would accept so they could get their fee's back. I do have a receipt though.


That seems to indicate that they are prepared to give your money back if you enter the dispute amicably and avoid the cost of fees to them.
I know it doesn't say that but I can't think of any other reason for them doing that.

Talk again, but be clear whats happening.

Connor, that is too sweeping a statement, ebay is a real money saver, but anyone that buys a car from ebay without seeing/trying it will be very lucky to bag a bargain;)

[Inactive]

Ebay is very different because for some reason, people seem to think that the normal rules of buying a car - GO LOOK AT IT FIRST - don't apply. Apart from some specialist stuff, its mostly filled with stuff people can't shift by the normal means or they know has problems.

Regarding Ebay, it's an auction. If you buy from a regular auction it's sold as seen and the rules on second hand car sales don't apply.

You obviously havn't been to eBay for some time, the majority of cars on there are quite simply " On Sale ", not subject to auction.

Many sellers are main dealers.

If a car is not as descibed, the buyer does not have to go through with the contract.

As with any and every purchase, the " buyer beware " rule applies.

Nothing different about eBay.

[Tozer]

Buyer beware (caveat emptor) does not apply if it is a business to consumer transaction. Sale of Goods Act still applies which means that the warranties of satisfactory quality and fitness for purpose cannot be displaced.

[jdfallon1970]

Thanks everyone for your advice:

anewman - The tyres were the first thing I had checked when I got home at that point I had only done about 40miles.

I have contacted Trading Standards and they have told me that i have a strong case for getting some costs towards the tyres and the full costs towards the oil leak and the exhaust head being fixed.

Just for a point of interest Trading Standards said that even though it was an auction because it was an ebay auction its means that you can't physically attend. Therefore it does not fall under any regular auction rules but rather under the sale of goods act and distant selling regulations (whatever they are?).

[Keith]

distant selling regulations (whatever they are?).

Distance Selling Regulations? How do they apply when you accepted the quality of the goods when you inspected the vehicle and handed over your money.

I mean you did inspect it before purchasing the vehicle didn't you, or did you hand your money over then find the problems and expect that you shouldn't have to pay for what seems to me to be wear and tear? (apart from the oil leak)

[anewman]

Oil leaks are not really a problem so long as they're a slow drip, just top it up - although you would expect a car described as having no leaks to have no leaks.

[inmypocketnottheirs]

Distance Selling Regulations? How do they apply when you accepted the quality of the goods when you inspected the vehicle and handed over your money.

I mean you did inspect it before purchasing the vehicle didn't you, or did you hand your money over then find the problems and expect that you shouldn't have to pay for what seems to me to be wear and tear? (apart from the oil leak)

The Sale of Goods Act applies.