What happened to LPG?

[MiserlyMartin]

About 5 years ago, everyone was banging on about getting LPG cars and wanting to get existing cars converted. Now I hear nothing about them and people are talking about diesels mainly and occaisonally hybrids in particular, the Prius. What happened? I know the drawback is that you lose your bootspace but what was the problem? Was is an economy issue? I mean what kind of MPG figure is returned? Surely not so important if the price of the fuel is only 45p a litre? Was it no grunt from the engine?

Why aren't more people getting LPG? I've not seen one advertised from a motor manufacturer either for years. Have they given up with it?

[piggeh]

The tax on LPG fuel went up and the benefits were therefore diminished. I think it is still slightly more economical than diesel (I think about a 25% from what I recall), but then you have conversion costs, and extra maintenance costs for the engine & gas tanks.

The performance of the car & mpg is pretty much the same with LPG as it is with petrol, albeit it's almost half the price.

[Hermione54]

There were some real cowboys doing lousy conversions and that gave the whole thing a bad name. People suspect that if they pay £1000+ for a proper job it will take a long time to pay back in cheaper fuel, and there's always a strong possibility that the government will soon raise the tax on it to petrol/diesel levels.

[Markyt]

LPG round here is 43p / litre. Still cheaper, still makes sense if you can get a proper conversion and have the space to carry the tank.

[mcfisco]

I think a few things have lead to the slowing down of the initial LPG frenzy

The government used to make some fairly subtantial [~70%] grants available for some cars to be converted - not any more

LPG has a calorific value of around 20% less than petrol so you can expect around that figure in less MPG than a petrol engine.

Modern diesels are now retuning some pretty impressive MPG figures

A lot of people just don't like the idea of a gas tank in the boot

It's still cheaper to run LPG as long as you do reasonable miles but there isn't the big margin over other fuels that there used to be.

[balsingh]

I use LPG in my BMW. I bought the car alredy converted so I saved the initial fitting costs of the system. The LPG costs me 47.9/litre which is still half the cost of Diesel. Saves me loads!!!! The tanks sits in the spare wheel well so no loss of boot space.

My only complaint is the lack of fillign stations that sell LPG.

[MiserlyMartin]

Seems like a way to go is to buy a model that was made for LPG, but make sure it is costing no more than its petrol or diesel equivalent. But I don't see many used LPG cars for sale

[Crabman]

An LPG station (the only one I am aware of in my area) closed down about a year ago and is now a hand car wash and valet station :rotfl: The taxes are still rising so it will soon have hardly any advantage at all - no demand - no more gas stations offering it - catch 22.

Electric hybrids seem to be a little more prevalent these days... :o

[sideshow_matt]

An LPG station (the only one I am aware of in my area) closed down about a year ago and is now a hand car wash and valet station :rotfl: The taxes are still rising so it will soon have hardly any advantage at all - no demand - no more gas stations offering it - catch 22.

Electric hybrids seem to be a little more prevalent these days... :o



The duty is set to rise at the same rate as petrol/diesel until 2010. So if Petrol goes up 3p so will LPG.

I pay 39p a litre at the moment. No brainer really. Gas boys have all the fun :rotfl:

[david29dpo]

example. sister bought a petrol range rover for £15000, then paid £1500 for gas conversion. with petrol she got 13 miles to the gallon, with gas, the same but half the price so lets say 26 miles per gallon. could have bought a diesel one in the first place and got 28 miles per gallon for £14500. mad!

[sideshow_matt]

Well if you buy a range rover then yes. 4x4's are the scourge of the roads. I can get between 230-300 miles on £15 of gas in my astra sri. If I had gone for the smaller engine then a bit more I'm sure. LPG is a lot cleaner than diesel, even city diesel. The bit people seem to forget is that they only test the co2 from the cars. LPG produces drastically less air born particles, that cause breathing problems, and exacerbate respiratory problems like asthma and COPD.

LPG is used in indoor confined spaces to power vehicles such as fork lifts because of this reason. If they were using petrol or diesel, everyone would be off sick.

The money saving part is a major factor to the switch to LPG, but even if it was the same price as petrol now, I would use it, as it is so much cleaner. I notice no difference litre/mile on LPG than I do if I have to run on petrol. Modern conversions and factory fits (like mine) have come a long way.

[Ted_Hutchinson]

The Volvo I bought to tow my new caravan is LPG. It's great. I stupidly filled up with petrol when I first went out and since then 3000mls later, it's still not used half the petrol in that tank.
I've put in loads of LPG though.
It's a 2.4 SP80 and does about 30mg on petrol but when on LPG for the same money and TOWING I'm getting the equivalent of 40mpg.
Not every garage has LPG and the price varies somewhat between 43p and 48p litre. But at £10 -£15 a tankful it goes an awful lot further than £15worth of petrol would take it. I've only run out of lpg once and really I didn't notice the transition back to petrol.

[dieselglider]

I can remember LPG the 1st time around. It was '81 or '82 (last century!), and I was learning to drive in an LPG converted Mini. There was a toggle switch on the dash, and you had to remember to switch over to petrol before stopping the engine, so it would restart easily. The gas tank took up just a bit of the boot space!!

Iirc, petrol then, cost about 80p/gallon

(The instructor then changed to one of those new Metro 'hatchbacks', which felt like a grown-up car, what with longer travel pedals and softer suspension...what a car!)

[MiserlyMartin]

Those were the days. I wonder if now the EU have given up on getting rid of our metric measurements if they will start selling fuel by the gallon again? Are LPG designed cars the same price as Diesels?

[sideshow_matt]

Usually cheaper Martin

[Genie]

Just thought I'd add my experience too. I bought a used Zafira 1.8. LPG about 2 months ago and already the savings are great.

It takes me over 200 miles on £15 so great for motorways. Local driving is much less, but still far better than petrol. It's also a factory fitted type, so no messing about with switches.

Good thing I have 2 petrol stations quite near by that do LPG, and I've added a the UK LPG petrol stations POI to my TomTom, so should be easy to find one out of the area.

It's like being back in the days when petrol used to cost about 50 per litre and I had a 1 litre nissan micra :D

[mdecker_london]

I too have a Zafira with the factory LPG fitted. Fantastic economy, and best of all it's congestion charge exempt, so zero cost for driving in the zone rather than the £40 per WEEK it normally costs.

[ooo000ooo]

We sold our lpg converted toyota picnic to a mate, last week she went into the local garage and connected the hose to the towbar mounted filler and started gassing up. One of the other customers saw her doing it and ran into the garage to tell the cashier that some "stupid" woman was pumping petrol up her exhaust :rotfl:

[Wig]

I know this is another bumped up old thread but I'm going to reply anyway.

The government used to make some fairly subtantial [~70%] grants available for some cars to be converted
No they didn't it was all a con, you could get a good conversion done for 1000, or you could get a "grant" to be used with a govt "approved" converter. Trouble was these "approved" converters charged 2,000 - 2,500 to do the conversion, so you saved nothing by using them.


LPG has a calorific value of around 20% less than petrol so you can expect around that figure in less MPG than a petrol engine. You can expect about 10% less on LPG


LPG is still a good option depending on how much you pay for your LPG locally, and high fuel useage is really the only factor that makes it worthwhile.

Buying a diesel banger and using cooking oil is probably the best thing to do.

[harveybobbles]

We sell lots of Volvo S60 LPG and Vectra LPG's. Lots of LPG places round here. There is a place in the hills of Manchester somewhere that will sell it to you for around 37p. Much cheaper than any price i've spotted at filling stations.

The Volvo's are good b'cos you loose no boot space. Vauxhalls you do...

I've also noted from selling LPG cars, that if you live/work in london, you don't have to pay a congestion charge...

[Stan Laurel]

I'm new to the idea of LPG. I'm going to buy a factory fitted car. Any advice on used ones?

[david69]

vauxhall did alot of factory fit lpg systems

[balsingh]

and volvo too!!!1

[Wig]

I'm new to the idea of LPG. I'm going to buy a factory fitted car. Any advice on used ones?

There's no real reason to want a factory fitted one other than there's no hassle with insurance companies wanting certificates.

However if you want factory fitted you're looking at Volvo, Vauxhall and Ford.
Citroen did a few, but they are few and far between.

So if you want luxury and you can afford it go for a Volvo
If you want luxury but can't afford it go for a Vaux Vectra
If you want an economical car go for a smaller Vauxhall.

If you go for a Vauxhall get one which is late 2003 or 2004 and younger.
Do your homework on the emmissions banding for the LPG car of your choice, Vauxhall improved their emmissions on the 2005 cars, bringing the corsa LPG into band A.

[balsingh]

Talking of Corsa LPG ... a workmate had one. It was a 1.2 16v with factor fit converison. It averages 44mpg on the LPG which at petrol prices is a 80MPG+ equivalent. They kept the car until it had covered 140000 miles before trading it in for a LPG Astra.

[Wig]

I'm putting this here because it is one of our longest threads on LPG.

This article is wrong on so many levels
http://www.whatcar.com/news-special-report.aspx?NA=215836&EL=3130755

1) People don't (or shouldn't) sit on the train with their engines on.
2) Even if they did this would not cause any problem with an LPG car.
3) Drivers are not req'd to turn off their tanks on the ferry decks, indeed some cars don't have the access to the tank to be able to do this.
4) Manufacturer approved is certainly not the safest option. It is as safe as any other method of conversion. Manufacturer 'approved' (read 'commissioned') is only advantageous for cutting out all the hassle associated with LPG that comes from people who think there is something wrong with an aftermarket conversion.
5) Channel Tunnel have now done risk assessments on LPG and found it to be safe for tunnel use, but they still refuse to allow it. Even though they do allow LPG bottles to be carried. Nonsense!

Just thought I'd post that.

[jeannieblue]

I've just read thru this thread.

One point that I would like to question that was made about the congestion charge. I thought that if the car was bought new factory fitted LPG then you escaped the congestion charge. If it is fitted after market, then you have to pay the charge.

Is this right? Just curious, I drive a petrol focus. Some of us can't afford to be greener, its the initial outlay that b*ggers us up. :D

[MiserlyMartin]

Some time has passed since my intial starting of this thread. LPG is now costing 60p a litre around here. But diesel is 130p a litre now.

Is LPG a better bet now?

The cooking oil thing is fine in principle but have you tried finding a chip shop that will let you have the oil? Everybody is jumping on that bandwagon. Heck the chip shop owners know how valuable the oil is to you and they probably run their own cars on it!