Cost of tooth extraction?

[SnowyOwl]

I think I am going to need to have a molar tooth, right at the very back removed. After it breaking and fillings falling out twice, being refilled and breaking again, I'm getting rid. It's too painful on my jaw and on my wallet. But can anyone let me know what to expect in terms of the procedure and in terms of damage to my wallet?

I am not looking forward to the actual extraction though it'll be nice to be able to chew gum in safety, and eat/drink cold/hot things without pain again.

[Savvy_Sue]

I can only say that the two back top wisdom teeth I've had out have been a doddle compared to the previous hassle of having them filled. Don't remember cost so can't have been extortionate! I found the actual extraction uncomfortable but not acutely painful, and only needed to get used to the absence of tooth afterwards, maybe a few paracetomol and a little bit of bleeding, but nothing serious.

But I know some people have suffered more than I have both at the time and afterwards, so I hope yours goes OK!

[SnowyOwl]

Oh Savvy_Sue, I forgot about wisdom tooth extraction! I had one taken out about 16 or 17 years ago...it was a truly awful experience, he even sawed out a bit of bone! I HATED going to the dentist's, I had told him I was nervous and unhappy about the surgery but he didn't care he wanted to take my teeth out there and then. Looking back he was a money rip off merchant...he insisted I needed the wisdom tooth on the other side removed as well but I never ever went back to him. To this day I have never had trouble with that wisdom tooth, nor has any other dentist ever commented on my remaining wisdom tooth (I only ever had 2, the top ones aren't there). Or to put it another way, I don't believe there was anything wrong with my teeth, he just wanted to perform the surgery for a bit of practice and to make some money - of this I am convinced.

That episode put me off so much I didn't return to the dentist again for about 10, maybe 12 years..when I did venture back it was from the pain of an old filling that needed to be replaced, absolutely nothing else was wrong.

After lots of teeth grinding in my sleep I've broken some teeth and now find myself needing an extraction due to the stress I've caused my back gnashers. I'm not too scared, my current dentist is v.careful though it's a bit daunting to think of a tooth being pulled from my head as the roots are quite long. Oooo am giving myself the willies now.....!!

[hrafndot]

You've given me back the willies with your talk about long roots!! I've got a rear molar extraction on Thursday and i've been gibbering about it for weeks. I've got some valium to keep me calm and I'm having a dry run tonight to see how I react to it. My mum shamed me into being brave - she had her hip replaced under local anaesthetic. Whatever happens, it will be quick!

Rachel

[SnowyOwl]

My parents tell me that back in the good old days people used to tie a piece of string onto the offending tooth then tie the other end to a door. They would then slam the door thus bringing the tooth with it.

Whatever happens on Thursday THAT isn't going to happen!! Maybe plan something extra special to look forward to on Thursday evening and focus on that instead. Just a suggestion.:)

You will be fine hrafndot...please tell me I will be fine too...

Am amazed at your mum by the way, brave woman!

[hrafndot]

Thanks for your words Snowy. I wish you luck. Mum is amazing, she had the hip replacemenent op once under epidural, came home to recuperate then fell over and had to have the same operation done again, knowing what it was going to be like!

When it comes to my tooth loss, I feel grief because it was so unnecessary. I had been telling my dentists since 2002 that I had an abscess, this was masked from the xray by an inlay. Now it has fractured and must come out.

From now on, I'm going to be listened to by my dentist and I will not hesitate to go to a dental hospital casualty to get advice. I trust my body and it was telling me exactly where the abscess was and what was happening. I was just too passive and pain tolerant.

good luck with your treatment

[hrafndot]

Sorry, I got carried away and lost the plot.

COST - have you thought about taking out a dental cash back plan? I have one with WPA towards which I pay £9 per month. They then pay 75% of all dental costs up to £500 after which they pay 100%. You have to wait for three months after commencement of policy but are covered for emergencies after 14 days. I got my policy after reading Martin's article on cashback plans and would highly recommend it.

Rachel

[SnowyOwl]

Oh thanks Rachel,

My latest dentist has been so cheap....I'm in rural N.Ireland having moved here from London. I got a check up and two replacement fillings for £24.00 - my response was "you mean one hundred and twenty-four pounds?" - this of course based on my experience of dentists in London. A filling later fell out and was replaced for free!

I will look into the cashback schemes all the same - I've got two badly fitted crowns which I really want to have replaced so this would allow me to go ahead and get the work done, so good tip.

It's wonderful to find a good dentist...that cowboy/butcher who removed my wisdom tooth all those years ago really did me, himself and his profession a massive disservice because of his determination to do what he wanted rather than what I wanted. It's worth making these people listen, they might be experts, but they don't know everything. As in your case they can just make things worse if they don't take notice of what they are told.

Good luck on Thursday, I'm sure it won't be too bad, and I hope it goes smoothly. Do definitely give yourself something lovely to look forward to for Thursday evening or Friday.

Snowy Owl

[spankymonkey]

my mum has just had 2 teeth extracted and new teeth made to put on her plate. i could not believe how much she had to pay nearly £400!!!!! i was disgusted....

[SnowyOwl]

Spankymonkey, I am similarly disgusted.

There's a whiff of exploitation around dentistry I feel...how are we supposed to know what is a reasonable charge, what needs to be done and what alternatives are available. Bit like car mechanics really - most of us have little choice but to accept what they say and trust they are being open and honest rather than looking for a way to line their pockets.

Lots of dentists are of course honest but my experience tells me that not all of them are.

If they push the cashback schemes which hrafndot/Rachel described above, then are they possibly looking at ways to persuade us to get non-essential work done under the guise that we'd get most of the charges back? Betcha there are a few who have twigged onto that possibility and are getting richer on the back of it.

[Poppy9]

There were a few dentists lurking around the forum. They all seemed to join and make a couple of posts defending private dental care. Perhaps you could pm one of them to advise you of how to find out reasonable costs of getting work done. In theory as most dentists are now private isn't it easier to get a second opinion? If you have denplan, which locally all the dentists insist on, can you move from practice to practice or are you tied into one?

[SnowyOwl]

Interesting point Poppy9, it is after all a free market when you go to private dentists. I'm not sure how it would work by moving from one to the other for the best price on specific work to be done - they'd all charge for the initial consultation at the very least I'm sure and I suspect come up with different solutions to the same problem. There is also the continuity of care issue.

It's the trust between dentist and patient which I think is open to abuse and I think there are unscrupulous dentists out there who would take advantage of a patient's lack of expertise.

[hrafndot]

Just got back from my extraction, cruised through it, have spent the past two hours sucking cappucino through a straw, no I know I shouldnt have I will rinse my mouth out with salt water.

I was prescribed a tablet to relax me and I was so relaxed I wanted to cuddle the dentist. She said I mustn't get into the habit, I don't know what she meant!

I have awful teeth and I gulped to the dentist, "how long do you think I have til I need dentures". She said "NEVER". I don't care whether what she said was true or not, I'm ridiculously happy. BTW the extraction cost £20.

Good luck Snowy, hope this helps

[SnowyOwl]

Hey Rachel, I was thinking of you this afternoon...that's fab news that you sailed through it.:j All that anxiety is gone so you must be on a bit of a high now it's all over and done with. Brave you, as I know you were dreading it.

Thanks for letting me know so quickly about how it went...that is a comfort, I am not as nervous now about either the damage to my mouth or to my wallet.

Snowy Owl.

[jeryth]

I'm in a similar position to Snowy Owl; I've had toothache on and off for the past two years; as I am on morphine-based drugs I don't notice it often. I'm about to find out whether or not I have to lose my left 8 (previous 7 broke and was extracted years ago), and as a skint non-worker, I worry about the cost. But I believe it's about £30 private (in Burnley), and it'd be worth losing the pain for good. But it's the beginning of the end; I had some extractions because of a small jaw, leaving me with 24 adult teeth, now I'm starting to lose them; I feel old.

Good luck, look after yourself.

[Toothsmith]

In theory as most dentists are now private isn't it easier to get a second opinion? If you have denplan, which locally all the dentists insist on, can you move from practice to practice or are you tied into one?


Hello again Poppy!

You can get second opinions even if NHS, but it is likely that the most accurate opinion will come from a dentist who has been looking after you for ages and has got to know your mouth/habits/dental disease patterns.

When I see a patient for the first time, all I can base a treatment plan on is what has worked best before on similar mouths that I have seen. Of course, I always tell the patient exactly what I think the relative chances of success are though.

Denplan is just an agreement between you and your regular dentist, so the money you pay is not transferable to another dentist.

Also with second opinions there is the issue of radiation exposure. If you go to see several dentists and they all take X-rays, you'll look like a Ready Brek advert!! (Showing my age!)

The best way to find a dentist is through personal recommendation. Who do Friends/family/neighbours go to? Ring up the practice and speak to the receptionist. Is she friendly and welcoming or does she sound rushed off her feet and couldn't care less whether you come or not?

When is the soonest they can book you in? If it's months away that may not seem too bad if you've no problems, but what if you're in pain one day?

How quickly do they see regular patients with emergencies (I see all regular patients with problems within hours - but then my regular patients rarely have emergencies :D )

Can you go for a visit before making your first appointment? This may not immediately seem like an important thing, but if the fees are dear, where is the money going? Is the waiting area well presented? Are the surgeries clean and clinical? How old are the magazines? If it is a dear practice and it looks a mess then the money is not being invested in your care! If the fees are dear yet it looks clean comfortable and professional then it's at least having money spent on it!

Ask how the instruments are steralized, check that gloves are routinely changed between patients. Make a right nuisance of yourself. If they're doing everything right, they'd be pleased to tell you all about it.

The very worse way to find a dentist that is caring and professional is to ring up everywhere and say "How much is it to have a tooth pulled out"

I realise this doesn't really answer your question about what to expect and how much it will cost, but if you see your dentist for an assessment, which really should be done before anything, then s/he should be able to give you all that information before you committ to anything, and as Rachel found. The fear of the proceedure is in 99 cases out of 100 far worse than anything you'll actually experience in the chair.

Keep smiling!

;)

[Daft_Monkey]

I got the impression from my dentist (private), that if I ever needed my wisdom teeth removed, I would have been refered to my local hospital. Where apparently the extraction will be done free of charge most probably at the maxilofacial unit. Can anyone colaborate this?
If it can be done, could you explore that posibility?

[Toothsmith]

Unless wisdom teeth extractions are very straightforward, most dentists would refer into hospital.

Even if you are a private dental patient, you would be refered back into the NHS hospital system.

Hospitals are busy enough though. If a normal extraction was needed, the dentist would not refer you into hospital. (He'd be laughed at!!!!) :D

Keep smiling!

[AjayVerma316]

daft money, ive replied to my barclays thread. Would be nice if you could help me out thanks!!!

[Daft_Monkey]

Unless wisdom teeth extractions are very straightforward, most dentists would refer into hospital.
D'oh!!! You got me worried now! Where's me toothbrush?! :-)


Hospitals are busy enough though. If a normal extraction was needed, the dentist would not refer you into hospital. (He'd be laughed at!!!!) :D

Maybe she doesn't like the violence involved (pliers and all)! :-)
I don't think they do extractions at that dental surgery, in general. But it could also be that when the need arises, mine will be a bit difficult to remove (as you suggested).

[Toothsmith]

What's difficult for a general dentist is a piece of cake for an Oral Surgeon. Don't worry, I'm sure you'll be fine!

[SnowyOwl]

I got my dreaded tooth out today - there was an abscess underneath it and this determined its ultimate fate. The extraction was amazingly quick and easy, though of course aided with local anaesthetic, but quite a bit of blood afterwards. The dentist I have is v.good, careful and always says what he's going to do...a real treasure! Unfortunately today was his last day at this practice...

On leaving I found out I did't have to pay at all - I was lucky enough to get into an NHS practice,. When this particular course of treatment for this tooth started I was unemployed. Even though I have since obtained employment the charge to me was waived because it was completion of a course of treatment started whilst on benefits. I have always been under the impression there is always something payable regardless of employment status, so that was a good surprise.

[Savvy_Sue]

On leaving I found out I did't have to pay at all - I was lucky enough to get into an NHS practice,. When this particular course of treatment for this tooth started I was unemployed. Even though I have since obtained employment the charge to me was waived because it was completion of a course of treatment started whilst on benefits. I have always been under the impression there is always something payable regardless of employment status, so that was a good surprise.Glad you are OK, and that is a very good tip for those of us who are lucky enough to have NHS dentists: start to get your teeth fixed while on certain benefits and you can complete the course on the same basis! I did half know this because a colleague was panicking about it: she'd started some major work while not working, had postponed completion for personal reasons, and suddenly realised that she might now have to pay for it which she couldn't afford to do. She was SO relieved when she found out she didn't have to pay and could still get the work done!

[Toothsmith]

Did you find out why it was his last day at the practice Snowy? :confused:

Might it have been anything to do with the fact that for all that lovely care and attention he was paid less than £20 by the NHS. And out of that has to pay for the staff, overheads, and everything else?

I once rang up a local piercing parlour. To have a tongue stud put in by some sweaty oik who may have done a days training course, but doesn't have to have done, with no control on how his instruments are steralized (If indeed they are) with just a topical anaesthetic and a lump of ice to control swelling & bleeding afterwards. No requirement for indemnity insurance, no registration. Guess how much?

£35 :mad:

Lucky to have NHS dentists? More like miraculous in this day and age.

Make it an issue before May 5th, 'cos nothing will be done about it afterwards!!

If only we had a dentist version of Jamie Oliver :beer:

Or maybe your dentist just had a call from the Vatican about an upcoming vacancy?? :o

[SnowyOwl]

Hi Toothsmith

Sorry for the delay in replying to your message. My now ex-dentist was I think a fairly recent graduate, and I suspect was employed at that practice specifically for NHS work. They have replaced him with someone else who is also v.young (and also ginger though I am sure that's nothing to do with it:D ). I didn't realise that he had two part-time jobs - he's gone to the other surgery on a full-time basis (four days a week actually, lucky so and so), which is not an NHS practice as far as I know.

Is it usual for new graduate dentists to gain experience in an NHS capacity and then to move into private dentistry once they have a bit of experience? I want to give this new dentist a chance, especially as she's young and eager, but then again I also want some continuity of care and will get fed up with having a new dentist every year.

Are there any plans on an NHS policy level to have dentists offer some of their time for NHS work, in a similar way that medical consultants do? It would be wonderful to see dentists give a bit back after all that expensive training (mostly) funded by us taxpayers. Dental prices are v.high, a reflection of the skill and knowledge required - but if you were sceptical and cyncial you'd say that there was a bit of moneygrabbing going on too and that profit margins are highly disproportionate to outlay. But I'm not sceptical or cyncial, just glad that dentists exist and mindful that what I do is v.influential on keeping my dentistry costs down!

BTW I have noticed you've been busy posting recently. Thanks for this, you've given lots of very helpful and even illuminating advice eg delaying brushing your teeth after eating, and about chewing gum for 20 mins - these things are very useful to know, so thanks again it's much appreciated.

Snowy Owl.

[Teerah]

Hi snowyowl

New dental graduates are started off in practice via vocational training programs. This means that the new graduates are fully qualified and trained but are eased into "the real world" by being placed in a practice where they have a trainer or mentor. The idea being that they can gain experience and confidence in practice and get to grips with the NHS system without being thrown in at the deep end, their trainer is there to help them if they have any problems. It sounds like your last dentist was a vocational trainee and as these contracts last one year they have probably been replaced by another new graduate. Some practices do this every year which unfortunately doesnt do much for continuation of care as most patients move from trainee to trainee.
New graduates must do this year of vocational training if they ever want to own their own practice. However, if they dont want their own practice they can skip this "NHS" year. Unfortunately for the NHS there is currently nothing to stop graduates going straight to private practice after the vocational training year.

[Sofa_Sogood]

my mum has just had 2 teeth extracted and new teeth made to put on her plate. i could not believe how much she had to pay nearly £400!!!!! i was disgusted....

:eek:

I might stick with my gappy smile.

[Toothsmith]

Teerah answered the bits about vocational training very accurately (Are you one of us?? (Secret handshake! :beer: ) ) with the exception of the bit about a dentist needing to do vocational training (VT) if they want to own a practice.

All dental graduates have to do VT, whether they want to own a practice or not and an NHS practice is normally the route as it is organised by the NHS. In areas where NHS practices are thin on the ground, it has been known for private practitioners to be approved as VT trainers, but politically this is frowned upon.

It is seen as much better to teach all these new graduates to forget all they've learnt at dental school about doing it properly, in order to do it in a way that still manages to get the bills paid on the NHS. The fact your nice caring dentist scooted off to private practice as soon as he/she could speaks volumes I think. He obviously wanted to work somewhere wher he could do it properly rather than do 'Turkey twizzler' dentistry on a budget.


Are there any plans on an NHS policy level to have dentists offer some of their time for NHS work, in a similar way that medical consultants do? Snowy Owl.

Not that I'm aware of, despite the fact the politicians say they are ploughing shedloads of money into it. None seem to find it's way to the frontline. I would do as much NHS work as they would want me to provided it paid the bills. It doesn't, but that was a different thread, and there's no way I'll ever convince the real sceptics that I don't have a second house in Nice which I drive to in my Aston!

It would be wonderful to see dentists give a bit back after all that expensive training (mostly) funded by us taxpayers. Snowy Owl.

Ask your new graduate how much of a student loan she has to repay and how heavily in debt she was at the end of her course! Then tell her you funded that :p I bet she'll be a bit light on the anaesthetic after that one. :rotfl:

BTW I have noticed you've been busy posting recently. Thanks for this
Snowy Owl.

It's quite good fun really. I'm doing my bit for positive PR for us big bad private exploiters of misery :A

[Teerah]

Teerah answered the bits about vocational training very accurately (Are you one of us?? (Secret handshake! :beer: ) ) with the exception of the bit about a dentist needing to do vocational training (VT) if they want to own a practice.


I'm pretty sure VT is only compulsory if the dentist wants to become a principal, unless this has recently changed? Oh and you guessed right about me toothsmith ;)

[Sofa_Sogood]

Just out of interest, and whilst this topic's still 'live', do dentist's do domiciliary visits and treatment?

Btw, glad you got sorted SnowyOwl and Rachel. How's jeryth doing?

And SnowyOwl? If it was an abcess (ouch), were you put on antibiotics afterwards?

[SnowyOwl]

Ask your new graduate how much of a student loan she has to repay and how heavily in debt she was at the end of her course! Then tell her you funded that :p I bet she'll be a bit light on the anaesthetic after that one. :rotfl:



Debt is the stark reality for many, many students, including those who go into careers much less lucrative than dentistry. I know two new graduates both with starting salaries of £14k and both in debt to the tune of around £6k each, it will take them years and years to pay it all back as their salaries in their careers will rise v.v.gradually. If they are on £20k three years after graduation then they will be v.lucky. The dentistry courses may be longer than 3 years and so debts will probably be higher, but in such a lucrative career they will be able to pay it back quicker and easier. Do the fees that students pay actually cover all the costs of their course anyway? I don't think so...taxpayer money still funds education.

Your advice has been great but this argument just doesn't hold water...

[Toothsmith]

Debt is the stark reality for many, many students, including those who go into careers much less lucrative than dentistry. I know two new graduates both with starting salaries of £14k and both in debt to the tune of around £6k each, it will take them years and years to pay it all back as their salaries in their careers will rise v.v.gradually. If they are on £20k three years after graduation then they will be v.lucky.

This is true, but they have a free choice about what job they do. English grads are not forced to work in libraries, law grads do not have to pay back their debt to society by only doing legal aid work for x years etc etc. Many mothers positively glow with pride when recounting how their little Nigel got a job with Countitt & Stash PLC on £xxxxxxx pa after getting a 2.1 in Meeja Studies. For dentists, this seems to be a sin though. Plus, the more you earn, the more tax you pay, so the quicker you pay back society. Society is not 'payed back' with substandard dentistry.

The dentistry courses may be longer than 3 years and so debts will probably be higher, but in such a lucrative career they will be able to pay it back quicker and easier.

The average dental student these days qualifies with a debt of £30,000. Not only is the course longer in terms of years, dental students only get about 8 weeks hoildays in total after their first year (Most students only do a 26-27 week YEAR for all 3 years). This increases living expenses whilst cutting down the available time for holiday jobs.

Plus, when I was a student in the mid 80's (Ahhh Those fashions! :rolleyes: ) the average cost of my text books was about £40-£50 EACH. I bought a dental materials book for £125. Medical books are not mass market things, and their cost is phenomenal. True, there are libraries and also second hand book sales organised by the student societies. Libraries only have so many copies though, and these books are updated regularly, so you can't buy a too older second hand one.


Do the fees that students pay actually cover all the costs of their course anyway? I don't think so...taxpayer money still funds education.


Again true. But us taxpayers also fund the computer systems that go over budget by BILLIONS and still don't work, the MPs who claim £88,000 in travel expenses every year, the bombs that created those lovely little armless Iraqi children so lovingly described as 'collateral damage' etc etc etc

There doesn't seem to be much money left in the pot when it comes to these minority side issues such as decent funding for education and healthcare. :mad:

We are on the same side Snowy. Don't let the media cloud the real issues.

[Toothsmith]

Just out of interest, and whilst this topic's still 'live', do dentist's do domiciliary visits and treatment?



Domicilliaries. I’m really going to go off on one now, so scroll down if you like!! :o

I used to do a ‘dommy run’ about once a week, back in the days when there were lots of residential homes (Have you noticed how they’ve all disappeared now as well?). Then the Regulators set in. :mad:

In our surgery we have to have an emergency drugs kit, filled with various bits and pieces to aid people in the event of serious medical emergencies. These kits are not cheap, and some of the drugs they contain have quite short shelf lives. So they have to be updated quite frequently. The out of date drugs also cost money to get rid of. In 17 years of practice, all I’ve ever needed are the cheapo glucose tablets for the odd person having a dizzy do.

We also need to have an oxygen supply readily available. These bottles are also not cheap to buy/rent, and they need regular maintenance. I have needed to use oxygen once, for someone having a laryngeal spasm.

Now, according to the Regulators, when we go out on the road, we are still practicing dentistry, so all this paraphernalia needs to come with us. That’s a real problem if there is still a dentist or hygienist still working back at the practice, as they will not have them. For the times that we are now called to do dommy visits, it really is not worth buying and maintaining two sets of emergency equipment.

Plus…. Taking an oxygen cylinder anywhere in your car is transporting a hazardous compressed gas. That needs a license!!!! That costs, and warning signs must be clearly visible on your vehicle.

Plus… Any rubbish generated on the visit is either clinical waste or trade waste. This cannot be disposed of in the bin of the place you are visiting, nor can you bring it back to the surgery without a ‘control note’ and a licence to transport clinical waste and another to transport trade waste. (This does not matter if you go to a residential home, as they will have their own disposal arrangements.)

So, that is why dentists don’t do dommys so much now. The only times we do, we’re generally breaking some law or guideline somewhere. I can just see the press report.

Woman Dies due to Dentist Negligence

A family is today in mourning after the loss of their beloved grandmother. Mrs. Emily Oldfolk (87) died during a home visit of Dr. James Toothsmith after her family had contacted him with a request to have a look at her lower denture which was ‘rubbing a bit’. During that visit, Mrs Oldfolk suffered a cardiac arrest and died.

In court, Dr. Toothsmith admitted not carrying the correct resuscitation equipment, stating that he though he was only going to be ‘smoothing a bit off’ the lower plate.

Solicitor for the family Graham Chasers, of D’Ambulance Chasers Willgettcha stated ‘The family is devastated. Dr. Toothsmith was clearly not following clear guidelines laid down for the safety of patients and as such he has been shown to have been negligent. The family will be pushing for a six figure settlement. They would like to make it clear that the money is not important, but the message that this sends to the rest of the profession. Risking patient safety by riding roughshod over the rules will not be tolerated. We hope Dr. Toothsmith will never again be able to practice as a dentist.’

Dr Toothsmith was also fined £10,000 and ordered to pay costs for the other charge of throwing a tissue that he’d used to wipe the patients mouth into her normal domestic refuse.



Sorry to go on!!!! :o

[Savvy_Sue]

:rotfl:I know it's not really funny, but you have a way with words, Toothsmith. No wonder school dental inspections also seem to have disappeared - and they only looked inside the mouths with a mirror!

I'm sure there must be some, but I've never been registered with a dentist who had level access to the practice! Current one has steep outside steps up to the main door, then awkward corners inside, plus one of the dentists is upstairs. Made it very difficult for her when she needed crutches / wheelchair during pregnancy!

[Toothsmith]

Now you're only trying to wind me up about disability discrimination legislation aren't you!!!!! ;)

[Savvy_Sue]

Now you're only trying to wind me up about disability discrimination legislation aren't you!!!!! ;)No, I promise I wasn't trying to wind you up, just commenting!

[Sofa_Sogood]

Domicilliaries. I’m really going to go off on one now, so scroll down if you like!! :o

<snipped> :D


Sorry to go on!!!! :o

I only wanted a consultation because I couldn't get to my dentist (whoever he/she is now) but you have a good old rant about domicilliaries - I hope you feel better by the way :D

It was only a question by the way, not an accusation about would be "ambulance chasers" if anything went wrong. As a mum of an "ambulance chaser" :o I think I know who to avoid lol.

As a friend of someone who actually makes plates, dentures, and 'Maryland bridges', I might ask them to help.

Or the local stonemason :D

Seriously. Sorry I asked about such a touchy subject, I didn't realise what was involved. I only asked because I remember one of my (now not with me)parents having home treatment and thinking how good it was.

But that was a while ago.

Meanwhile, please stay and answer all these questions :)

For what it's worth, and just as an afterthought, I've had 3 Maryland bridges fitted. I 'lost' one once and was told to wait a while as it wasn't an emergency. It wasn't, but I was about to meet and greet a lot of people and didn't want to give them a gappy grin. The dentist said - and these are his words - not mine, that "if I'd been a singer I'd have been dealt with much sooner". Like immediately. Huh?? :confused:

I nearly burst into song until I remembered (apart from the dentist having no recording studio etc), I was tone deaf and couldn't sing to save my life, ergo, I'd have been caught out lol.

Keep posting won't you? I love the friendly repartee, but more so, the advice and commitment you all show.

Thanks.

[Toothsmith]

There are only 2 'Real' dental emergencies. Uncontrolled bleeding and swelling likely to endanger the airway.

Everything else, even severe pain will not kill you. Whilst dentists run their own out of hours services though, we tend to be a lot more sympathetic and can come out to all sorts of things.

With the 'new dental contract' for the NHS, PCT's will take over organising NHS emergency cover, and with the funding problems they are going to have, I'd bet my mortgage that it will only be available for 'true ' emergencies.

Dentists are very cross about this, as the little funding we were given to provide the emergency service will go, and yet we will probably still be the first point of contact for a patient with an emergency. As we are seen as being 'responsible' for our patient's care we will also be blamed when they cant be seen with what they consider is an emergency!

So the choice for us will be pass the patient on to the PCT service, where we know they probably won't be seen, or do it ourselves for free.

Of course, patients of private dentists will still have the same arangements as before with their own dentist providing cover.

Most private dentists still see kids on the NHS though, so we have to decide how we're going to handle that one in the event of out-of-hours emergencies.

[Toothsmith]

For what it's worth, and just as an afterthought, I've had 3 Maryland bridges fitted. I 'lost' one once and was told to wait a while as it wasn't an emergency. It wasn't, but I was about to meet and greet a lot of people and didn't want to give them a gappy grin. The dentist said - and these are his words - not mine, that "if I'd been a singer I'd have been dealt with much sooner". Like immediately. Huh?? :confused:


Thanks.

Sorry I forgot to answer this bit. :o

Depending on when the bridge was made, when it came off and what cement your dentist has to stick it back on with, Marylands often have to go back to the lab to be re-etched before you can stick them back on. This takes a day or two.

If you really had something ultra important to do, it could just be stuck back on, but that would not last very long, and so it would have to be taken off, to be re-etched, to be stuck back on. (Bit like waking someone up to give them a sleeping pill) Now you'd be surprised how many times Sod's Law kicks in in dentistry, and It's very likely, when the dentist wanted to get it off, it wouldn't budge, or worse still, break. So he'd decide to leave it.

Then, just when your next improtant event came up, it would just drop off again :p

That was probably why your dentist decided to leave it - not just cos you have a voice like a bullfrog :rotfl:

Of course, when he got to see it, he could well have realised it would just stick straight back on, but he'd not know that over the phone, and it would be a waste of both your times if he couldn't do it there and then at a weekend.

PS Whenever I go off on one, it's nothing personal against the person who's asked the question. It's just there is sooo much about our job and the rules we have to follow that the public just have no idea on.

If there is something in my posts that makes you grin, then you can assume I'm smiling as I wrote it!!!

[Sofa_Sogood]

Hi Toothsmith and thanks again :D

My first Maryland lasted far longer (and was far cheaper) than the other two (?). I think it lasted about 5 or 6 years, maybe more - so money well spent in my opinion.

Then it loosened and fell out.

My then dentist wasn't available to me, so I went 'up market', or as up market as I could taking into account of where I lived, and had one fitted by a dentist that warned me it could fall out again. He did say why - something about the weakness in the teeth on either side of it being the problem (I think).

That Maryland lasted about 48 hours maximum, and there wasn't any recourse, no money back guarantees, as I said.

But for it to fall out after less less than 48 hours and it costing a small fortune, (about 3 or 4 times the original cost), really disheartened me so much, I found another and cheaper dentist. The one who thought he was Simon Cowell ;)

He did his best, but he was terrible. I can only say that he was bad after he gave me an anaesthetic, for another tooth that I was in pain with, and let in another patient, and the anaesthetic wore off. As it was a little girl in pain with toothache, I didn't mind, until I sat in the chair for an extraction. *Those of you with a nervous disposition, stop reading now* ;)

It was excrutiating. Hmmm. But I let him fit my very last Maryland not long after (my dates are all to pot - sorry) and that fell out in a packed Mcd's or similar In Leicester Square! But for some reason, I'd bought some Denture Fix stuff and literally used that to 'temporarily' glue it into place. Short term it worked. Long term and it looked bad, but I couldn't eat with my front teeth by that time anyway, because it was just a short term fix. BUT ... it was good.

I've just realised that another dentist must have been involved (because I had the full sparkling gleam lol) for my daughter's wedding - so my last dentist must have removed the Maryland (and the effects on the two side teeth completely) and fitted the one that I have now, that's on a 'wire'. That didn't move at all by the way. It just irritated me when I ate. In fact, I took it out to eat, and as it was so small and unnoticable, I eventually left it out. Now it just about fits. Look - :D ;)

Since then I've broken and pulled out myself (I told you sensitive lot to look away lol) another tooth and I daren't even attempt to put this thing that measures all of a centimetre or two, back in. But because I did what I did, my top palate (sp?) which only has one tooth that's really noticeable, was left out too - and that doesn't fit at all :(

So - do I do as my sister in law suggests and have the lot extracted and look at titanium & cosmetic work? Or persevere with a dentist I haven't got, (and I'm scared to visit), and continue with, what's all said and done, short term remedial work?

Phew, that took some writing :D

By the way, go off on one whenever you like. Just keep posting lol. They make me grin, even if it's a toothy grin lol.

Apologies for the length of the post, but dentists and dentistry have always let me down. And it's been very costly. Like being hospitalised costly for yet another tooth problem. So what's your advice? Apart from to see a dentist a.s.a.p.?

Thanks in advance Toothy ;)

P.S. I'm tempted to have them all extracted, that's how 'delicate' they seem to be.

What's left of them anyway ;)

[Sofa_Sogood]

It might be better to PM specific advice Toothsmith. I just remembered that health issues are a bit of a dodgy area in the forum.

Thanks in advance anyway. :)

[Toothsmith]

__________________________________________________ _____________


I've drawn a line :p

If you were in my chair Sofa, with a good range of X-rays in front of me then I might just be able to have a decent stab at what to do next.

That guess would be based on what seemed to work for other patients in similar circumstances. The longer I practice, the better my guesses get but I still have things that go 'T*ts up' every now and again :o .

As I've never worked on your mouth though, I really could not have any idea exactly what would work and what wouldn't.

This is the problem people encounter when they change dentists a lot (Either through choice or necessity).

Every new dentist is starting from scratch, even if he has access to his predecessors notes. He may do 'the same' treatment in a different way and so something that didn't work for the previous dentist might do for him, and vice versa.

My best advice must always be to find a dentist you're happy with. (Friends & neighbours recommendations are best) Do your best to check they will be at the practice for the long term. (How long have they been there, do they have a financial share of the practice, how close to retirement are they, do they charge enough to make the practice sustainable, etc) and then take their advice and stick with them!

Unfortunately this may not be the cheapest option in financial terms, but it will save you time, grief, teeth and ultimately money in the long term.

Hope this helps. ;)

[Sofa_Sogood]

Hi Toothsmith,

I've avoided this post like I avoid the dentists check ups - sorry :o

Why are you lot so scary? lol ... Even in a forum :D

I think my best bet would be to bite the bullet (and hope I don't break another tooth ;)) and just go with the same dentist my husband uses.

But the thought of going with my tooth missing at the top (because I took the wire bridge out when I had 'flu and a sore throat) and now my bottom tooth (because I pulled my own tooth out when I broke it and the wire thing no longer fits) is just sooo embarrassing.

It's no good is it? I'll have to go and make some excuse up - like the dog ate them :D

I could tell you some bad experiences with dentists, but that might scare other people lol, but the best one I had upped sticks and left. She was great - newly qualified and even said that yet another broken tooth (that I still have but at the back) might as well be left until it bothered me. Might not be the best advice but it suited me.

I'll make an appointment with hubbys dentist. He might be expensive, but I know he's good.

Thanks again!

From Gappy ;)

P.S. Do many people blame the dog? :D

[Toothsmith]

Good Luck - It's for the best really :T

Just remember, no matter how bad you think your mouth is, he'll have seen worse, and he'll probably have seen worse that day!

We don't look at 'bad' mouths in the way you think we do. It's not really to do with how bad it is, but the best way to put it right.

Dogs do get blamed for a lot of dental mishaps, as well as school homework mishaps, and funny smells in the lounge when Great Aunt Maude comes to visit :rotfl:

They really do seem to love having a chew at dentures for some reason :confused:

All the best!

[Sofa_Sogood]

Good Luck - It's for the best really :T

Just remember, no matter how bad you think your mouth is, he'll have seen worse, and he'll probably have seen worse that day!

We don't look at 'bad' mouths in the way you think we do. It's not really to do with how bad it is, but the best way to put it right.

Dogs do get blamed for a lot of dental mishaps, as well as school homework mishaps, and funny smells in the lounge when Great Aunt Maude comes to visit :rotfl:

They really do seem to love having a chew at dentures for some reason :confused:

All the best!

I make it sound like I've got 'Summer teeth' - 'some are there and some aren't' :D

It's only two teeth after all but I'm such a scaredy cat :o and I'm ok when I actually get there ..... it's building up the courage. Doesn't help that I get in a tizz just being out :D

Thanks Toothsmith, it's not an option I have anymore I don't think. Since I pulled my own tooth out (mentioned in another thread I think) it doesn't seem to be healing up :(

But I will make the appointment no matter what it costs and I think the dog's getting the blame. ;)

(P.S. And this is slightly off topic, but do you or any of your colleagues ever watch Emmerdale? I'm only asking because husband and I keep having the same argument about Nicola Blackstock/Nicola Webster. Are her teeth undergoing treatment? I say she is - other half says she just has awful teeth :confused: Sorry to go off topic, but it drives us both nuts when we watch it ;))

Off to find some courage from somewhere.

Thanks again :)

[rharper83]

Sofa: I think it looks like orthodontics (is that the right word??) or fixed braces that she's wearing, and because the TV is quite hard to see details on, you can't really tell... :)

I've been reading this thread tonight, and it's quite interesting. I'm in the middle of a dentistry mess and just getting re-registered with an NHS dentist. About 2 years ago I had really bad toothache in a tooth, and had to go see a dentist (I'm scared witless by them, and hadn't been for.... well a while shall we say! :( ), and it turned out I had an abcess, so I was given anti-biotics, and had other work doing (which needed doing). I also visited 4 different dentists in the course of a week, all trying to sort this, and the one at my uni was VERY patronising, and that just put me off them even further. Having finaly settled on a dentist, and had some work done, she told me she was leaving and going back to her home town! :( I was told to make another appointment, but as their computers were down, I'd have to call back the following day. I kinda 'forgot' and they never called me, and 16 months later (just over the 15 month limit!!!!) I had toothache again - 2 weeks ago, and they said I couldn't be registered again as they weren't taking on NHS patients but they did treat me in the emergency on good friday too!

This thread has helped me to realise the amount of work the dentists have to do, and that there are differences between private and NHS work (unfortunately). As I'm a student, is there any way of getting private treatment cheaper if I'm not able to get NHS registered?

Thanks! Richard.

[Teerah]

I think private charges are fixed richard, dont think there are any discounts for any groups

[Sofa_Sogood]

rharper83 :) I'm relatively new myself but hi and welcome.

At least it's not just me and the other half that watch Emmerdale then? Thanks for that ;)

I had an abcess which is how I lost one of those darned teeth that needed a false one, but not until I'd had treatment for about 6 months with one dentist.

He discharged me saying that it was fine, when it clearly wasn't - so the same week, (could have been the same day - I forget), I was ferried to another dentist, looked at and x-rayed etc. It was at the time when people had a 'choice', but nearly as soon as she looked at it she offered me hours spent in her dentist's chair, or hospital - which we both agreed was the best option. It failed, the abcess reappeared (which only showed up thanks to an X-ray and a suspicion by me) but I was the first patient my dentist knew of where it failed, and one of a few that the hospital knew of too.

So I had the option of going back into hospital for the same op, or an extraction. After so long I opted for the extraction.

BUT - I miss my tooth and maybe I might have chosen differently if I'd known how uncomfortable a false tooth can be.

As I'm not a dentist, just a patient, albeit a lapsed one like yourself ;) I'll leave it to the experts from now on. But good luck (and get it seen to .... pronto!)

:)

P.S. Your doctor can help with part of the fear via a small sedative, but don't be in pain or discomfort, get it looked at as soon as possible.

I should take my own advice shouldn't I? :o

As I said though - good luck. Not all dentists are scary - honest! :) And Toothsmith's great in my opinion :D

[Sofa_Sogood]

I also visited 4 different dentists in the course of a week, all trying to sort this, and the one at my uni was VERY patronising, and that just put me off them even further.

Just another afterthought.

You should never have the feeling of being 'patronised' by anyone offering a service. Or anyone at all. Even dentists. Find a good one, stick with them, and just hope that they don't disappear ;)

Now I'm going to practise what I'm preaching. I'm going to get mine sorted as soon as possible.

Get yours looked at too. The dentists that post on here will help in some way I'm sure.

Take care.

[hunky-dory]

:mad: New guidelines brought out April 2008 say that for anyone with heart conditions DO NOT not now need penicillin cover for tooth extractions or any invasive dental treatment. I consulted two independent dentists who both told me the same info . I had an extraction yesterday without penicillin cover despite extensive inflammation and was very uneasy about it and trawled the internet to now find out that 70% of Cardiologists NOW DISAGREE with the findings and want to continue with the penicillin treatment. I contacted my own GP who IMMEDIATELY prescribed antibiotics for me. I had endocarditis resulting in a defect in a heart valve. THIS I can categorically relate to a blundered delivery many years ago. I should at least have been consulted to how I felt about it all.
Anyone on the forum with the same condition please consult your GP before embarking on any dental treatment.

[Toothsmith]

:mad: New guidelines brought out April 2008 say that for anyone with heart conditions DO NOT not now need penicillin cover for tooth extractions or any invasive dental treatment. I consulted two independent dentists who both told me the same info . I had an extraction yesterday without penicillin cover despite extensive inflammation and was very uneasy about it and trawled the internet to now find out that 70% of Cardiologists NOW DISAGREE with the findings and want to continue with the penicillin treatment. I contacted my own GP who IMMEDIATELY prescribed antibiotics for me. I had endocarditis resulting in a defect in a heart valve. THIS I can categorically relate to a blundered delivery many years ago. I should at least have been consulted to how I felt about it all.
Anyone on the forum with the same condition please consult your GP before embarking on any dental treatment.


But also check that your GP would also be willing to carry out the dental treatment, as the dentist probably won't.

There is a much bigger risk of anaphalactic shock from taking a huge dose of antibiotic than there is of endocarditis after dental treatment.

The NICE guidelines were evidence based, and are sensible - unlike the cardiologists position which is basically just based on tradition.

If you think about it, then practically every time you brush your teeth and see a bit of blood, oral bacterial will have entered your blood system, but antibiotic cover prior to toothbrushing was never recommended - and no-one ever got endocarditis as a result.

In the past, cases of endocaritis were never investigated properly, and if a patient gave a history of 'attending the dentist' anything up to a year before the episode, it would just automatically be blamed on that. Which is a bit silly if you stop and think about it.

The doctor who prescribed you the antibiotics was being very silly.. If there WAS a risk, then the antibiotics now would do no good at all now anyway, and if it was the 3g dose he gave you and didn't supervise you for an hour afterwards, he was putting you at much more risk than a few bugs in your system.

[Teerah]

Couldnt agree more. The antibiotics you took have done nothing but place you at risk of anaphlyactic reaction. The bacteraemias (amount of bacteria in the bloodstream) produced by toothbrushing as toothsmith mentions and simple things like eating are equivalent to something like an extraction if actually not less. If you consider whats happening with an extraction, the blood is coming out of the socket, theres not much moving the other way. You were at a greater risk of endocarditis when you had the dodgy tooth in your mouth.

I wont prescribe antibiotics to cover such conditions any more as per current guidelines. If a cardiologist were to insist on it, I would request that they prescribed and supervised the antibiotics themselves. The situation hasnt occurred yet.