Dentist Help

[Miroslav]

I have lumps of swelling over my teeth which are causing me massive pain but I am not registered with any dentist.

I had to go to the Doctor today anyway, so asked for advice when there. She suggested..........going to the dentist, but had no idea about any of the local dentists.

I phoned my nearest dental access centre which I found on the NHS site, but the lady told me I had to ring the local dental advice line, so they could make an appointment with said dental access centre for me.

I've tried ringing my local dental advice line, but they are unavailable to answer my call.

I am in agony, not eaten for 3 days and very tired as had little sleep. I am living on soluble painkillers!

Any advice on what I should do next? I just want to get rid of this pain.

[barber1982]

OH you poor thing.. i had the same problem last month hadnt been to the dentist for 4 years co i thought i couldnt afford to. Luckily i found an NHS Dentist nearby... Anyway have you tried the hospital some have dental schools. Where in the country are you and i will do a search for you (Bored at work)

[Saucepot]

I think your local A&E might have an emergency dentist. Worth a try, give 'em a bell.

[Miroslav]

OH you poor thing.. i had the same problem last month hadnt been to the dentist for 4 years co i thought i couldnt afford to. Luckily i found an NHS Dentist nearby... Anyway have you tried the hospital some have dental schools. Where in the country are you and i will do a search for you (Bored at work)

It's been nearly 4 years myself, since my last dentist did work on me I didn't know he was doing until it was done :mad:

I thought of the hospital, but would feel silly if I went there and they didn't do anything to help.

I'm in Somerset

Thanks

[Miroslav]

I think your local A&E might have an emergency dentist. Worth a try, give 'em a bell.

Hospital is only 15 minutes away, I might just walk down there and see if I can get a result

Thanks

[barber1982]

http://www.nhs.uk/england/authoritiesTrusts/pct/showWithinPCT.aspx?pct=5FW&serviceID=1

Try this link if you dont get any help at the hospital.. Can ring the dentists direct

[Miroslav]

Thanks, think I may go down the hospital and see what they say. I'll give the dental line another call first and see if they answer

[Toothsmith]

Any advice on what I should do next? I just want to get rid of this pain.

1.Find a proper dentist in a proper dental practice.

2. Get your teeth sorted out properly.

3. Listen to the diet and cleaning advice carefully, and put it into practise so they don't get into this state again.

4. Pay the bill and put it down to experience.

5. Continue to attend regularly.


I know this is not what you want to hear, but it is the reality of dental treatment in this country. You will get very little that is any good from the state, especially if you start from a position of not having a dentist.

Rearrange your budgeting to include good dental care.

[barber1982]

1.Find a proper dentist in a proper dental practice.

2. Get your teeth sorted out properly.

3. Listen to the diet and cleaning advice carefully, and put it into practise so they don't get into this state again.

4. Pay the bill and put it down to experience.

5. Continue to attend regularly.


I know this is not what you want to hear, but it is the reality of dental treatment in this country. You will get very little that is any good from the state, especially if you start from a position of not having a dentist.

Rearrange your budgeting to include good dental care.

I totally agree Toothsmith i neglected my teeth for years.. went to the dentist last week had a filling and a well needed clean. I feel so much better now will be going back every 6months. I was stupid thinking i couldnt afford to go, but i could afford to buy new clothes and stuff its no good if you teeth are falling out.. I have a NHS dentist but i pay for treatment

[Miroslav]

1.Find a proper dentist in a proper dental practice.

2. Get your teeth sorted out properly.

3. Listen to the diet and cleaning advice carefully, and put it into practise so they don't get into this state again.

4. Pay the bill and put it down to experience.

5. Continue to attend regularly.


I know this is not what you want to hear, but it is the reality of dental treatment in this country. You will get very little that is any good from the state, especially if you start from a position of not having a dentist.

Rearrange your budgeting to include good dental care.

I've just rang all the dental practices in my area and no-one is taking NHS patients, not even disabled ones like myself, and none are willing to do an emergency treatment.

Looks like I'm going to have to put up with the pain.

[Miroslav]

http://www.nhs.uk/england/authoritiesTrusts/pct/showWithinPCT.aspx?pct=5FW&serviceID=1

Try this link if you dont get any help at the hospital.. Can ring the dentists direct

No luck with the hospital, and tried ringing the dentists, but none have spaces or will do emergency treatment.

Have left a message with my local Dental Helpline and asked them to ring back. That is my last hope.

My Doctor said she thought it was an infection, as I tend to bite my cheeks and gums when I sleep, so it's not down to poor oral hygeine as has been suggested.

Thanks for all your help, I may have to stick a fork or something in the lump to decrease it...........i'm gonna need alot of painkillers.

[barber1982]

Have you tried bonjella really helps me when i have gum problems........

[Miroslav]

Have you tried bonjella really helps me when i have gum problems........

Does that work with inflamed gums etc? I thought it was just for mouth ulcers?

If you think it may help, i'll pop out and get some now, as vinegar isn't working

[barber1982]

A. Bonjela gel contains an effective local analgesic called choline salicylate which helps to reduce the pain and inflammation associated with mouth ulcers. It also contains an antiseptic called cetalkonium chloride, which helps fight infection

I does help to numb your mouth worth a try

[Miroslav]

Thanks, i'm off to the pharmacy, as I have a prescription to collect. I'll pick some Bonjela up and ask the pharmacist if anything else may help.

Thanks for the help barber1982

[Toothsmith]

Looks like I'm going to have to put up with the pain.

No - you are going to have to find a dentist and PAY.

You can argue about the politics of all this later, but the NHS system is crap and deteriorating.

Bongella will not cure an abscess, which is what it sounds like you have.

Doing anything stupid in the way of DIY could make things 10 times worse.

GET IT SORTED OUT

[Saucepot]

It really has gone to the dogs, dental treatment in this country.
I registered with the only dentist accepting NHS in town a few years back, and have to consider myself lucky.

but why? I pay my taxes, I've paid for the NHS, why should I consider myself lucky? I'm only getting what I pay a lot for.

Those forced to go private (as in the only choice is stump up or rot) are paying up twice. Once for the treatement they can't get, and once for the treatement they do. Talk about rip off britain. I'm amazed it isn't an election issue.

If it comes down to it though, you can't put a price on your health. Money saving is a tool to a better life. Your health isn't worth scrimping and saving over, to it's detriment. I wouldn't be a fool that knows the price of everything and the value of nothing. I'd pay up, get it sorted and come election time vote for something better than this sorry lot.

[Miroslav]

No - you are going to have to find a dentist and PAY.

You can argue about the politics of all this later, but the NHS system is crap and deteriorating.

Bongella will not cure an abscess, which is what it sounds like you have.

Doing anything stupid in the way of DIY could make things 10 times worse.

GET IT SORTED OUT

Luckily, whilst I am considered disabled, I don't have to pay (unlike last time where I paid for a bodge job), but i've just had a phone call and I can see an emergency dentist tonight (5.30), and they have found me a dentist in my town willing to take me on, which contrary to your belief, I am very happy about, as it means i'm treated like normal person now, and not a disabled person, which as I say, I am very happy about.

Once I am able bodied again and able to earn my living once more, I will likely take out a Denplan (think that is what it is called?)

I believe the NHS has just about halved it's costs recently, which is great, although if I can afford Private in the future, I will likely do.

I'm just happy someone has finally acknowledged I exist!

Thanks for the advice.

[Miroslav]

It really has gone to the dogs, dental treatment in this country.
I registered with the only dentist accepting NHS in town a few years back, and have to consider myself lucky.

but why? I pay my taxes, I've paid for the NHS, why should I consider myself lucky? I'm only getting what I pay a lot for.

Those forced to go private (as in the only choice is stump up or rot) are paying up twice. Once for the treatement they can't get, and once for the treatement they do. Talk about rip off britain. I'm amazed it isn't an election issue.

If it comes down to it though, you can't put a price on your health. Money saving is a tool to a better life. Your health isn't worth scrimping and saving over, to it's detriment. I wouldn't be a fool that knows the price of everything and the value of nothing. I'd pay up, get it sorted and come election time vote for something better than this sorry lot.

Touch wood, I will have a new dentist very soon :)

My MP has made it his main issue, along with tax credits, so my next step was him, but it seems I may not need him now.

I agree with health being most important. As someone with poor health all my life, despite not drinking or smoking, I appreciate every last breath. My fear of the dentist came about after my last one messed everything up and only completing half the job.

Sadly, most of my money goes on my debts right now, but if I can save a few £'s here and there, it helps. I have a bit put aside, just incase.

[Miroslav]

Bongella will not cure an abscess, which is what it sounds like you have.


btw, if it is an abscess, how do they get rid of it, and does it hurt?

I know you're going to put the fear of life into me now :D

[barber1982]

Good luck hope you get some pain relief soon and you will be :D soon

[Miroslav]

Good luck hope you get some pain relief soon and you will be :D soon

I hope so. As much as I fear the dentist after the last chap (he's well known in my town for being an !!!!!) I am looking forward to getting this sorted,

[Toothsmith]

I've just had a phone call and I can see an emergency dentist tonight (5.30), and they have found me a dentist in my town willing to take me on.

That's great.


I believe the NHS has just about halved it's costs recently, which is great, although if I can afford Private in the future, I will likely do.


The NHS has changed from fees for each item, into a 3 band system.

the charge (For those that have to pay) will be £15.50, £42.20 or £189, depending on which band the treatment falls into.

Therefore, if someone needs a mouthful of fillings and root fillings, they will pay £42.40. This is loads cheaper than it was before 1st April

If someone needs on single, tiny filling, they will also pay £42.40. this is about 4x the price it was prior to April 1st.

The real bummer for dentists is that the credit they get for doing a huge treatment plan is just the same as they get for doing a simple little treatment. Therefore there is no incentive at all to take on patients who need loads of treatment. Quite the opposite. They will require such a lot of work for such a little points credit.

This makes a difference to dentists, who have to achieve a points target if they are to maintain the same NHS funding next year.

I cannot think of any reason why a dentist would want to take you on on the NHS, unless he is really being held over a barrel by his PCT.

Just make sure that the treatment you are being offered is what you really want.

The simplest thing the dentist could do would be to take out every tooth with a problem and provide a denture. This would get him maximum points for minimum outlay.

Be careful to discuss all alternatives with him, and come up with a treatment plan you are happy with (Of course - you may well be happy with that option).

[Miroslav]

That's great.




The NHS has changed from fees for each item, into a 3 band system.

the charge (For those that have to pay) will be £15.50, £42.20 or £189, depending on which band the treatment falls into.

Therefore, if someone needs a mouthful of fillings and root fillings, they will pay £42.40. This is loads cheaper than it was before 1st April

If someone needs on single, tiny filling, they will also pay £42.40. this is about 4x the price it was prior to April 1st.

The real bummer for dentists is that the credit they get for doing a huge treatment plan is just the same as they get for doing a simple little treatment. Therefore there is no incentive at all to take on patients who need loads of treatment. Quite the opposite. They will require such a lot of work for such a little points credit.

This makes a difference to dentists, who have to achieve a points target if they are to maintain the same NHS funding next year.

I cannot think of any reason why a dentist would want to take you on on the NHS, unless he is really being held over a barrel by his PCT.

Just make sure that the treatment you are being offered is what you really want.

The simplest thing the dentist could do would be to take out every tooth with a problem and provide a denture. This would get him maximum points for minimum outlay.

Be careful to discuss all alternatives with him, and come up with a treatment plan you are happy with (Of course - you may well be happy with that option).

So a dentist can refuse to take someone on based on how much work they need doing?

I would hope dentists cared about there patients enough, as my last one clearly did my mouth as quick as possible to waste as little time where he could be earning money elsewhere.

I'll discuss with the new dentist when I have definitely registered, and see what he comes up with, or I may have to go private in the future.

[Toothsmith]

So a dentist can refuse to take someone on based on how much work they need doing?

No - they can't.

There is a specific clause in the new contract that says just that. If you feel you have been rejected for that reason you could complain to the PCT.

When it will cost the practice far more in time and materials than they are getting in 'fees' (Fees don't exist anymore though, it is all points towards a target) you can see why a dentist would try to get out of taking on too many patients with loads of work needing doing.

Caring for patients doesn't come into it. You can't care for anyone when the bank repossesses your practice!

Personally though, I feel that any dentists stupid enough to sign this new NHS contract should play by the rules they have signed up to.


I would hope dentists cared about there patients enough, as my last one clearly did my mouth as quick as possible to waste as little time where he could be earning money elsewhere..

Again - a product of the system.

I'll discuss with the new dentist when I have definitely registered, and see what he comes up with, or I may have to go private in the future.

That's the best plan.

Be aware also that no-one is registered with an NHS dentist anymore. A dentist is only responsible for you whilst you are under treatment. As soon as you have finished treatment, you are 'unregistered' again.

So, this dentist will see you for this appointment for the emergency treatment tonight, for which he will get 1 point. Now - that will be it for that treatment. If it is the same dentist who is 'taking you on' you will then go back for an examination, and it is there that the treatment will be discussed. When you have agreed the treatment, you will then make more appointments, and you will the be 'his' patient until that treatment is finished.

If he starts talking about stuff that will be done in a 'few months time' then he is probably splitting up the treatmnet, as if there is a gap in the treatment of more than 3 months, he can claim a fresh batch of points and make it more worthwhile.

Again, this is breaking the rules. As you don't pay the charges, this will make little difference to you though.

Maybe best to go with it. He does have a practice to run after all.

[Miroslav]

No - they can't.

There is a specific clause in the new contract that says just that. If you feel you have been rejected for that reason you could complain to the PCT.

When it will cost the practice far more in time and materials than they are getting in 'fees' (Fees don't exist anymore though, it is all points towards a target) you can see why a dentist would try to get out of taking on too many patients with loads of work needing doing.

Caring for patients doesn't come into it. You can't care for anyone when the bank repossesses your practice!

Personally though, I feel that any dentists stupid enough to sign this new NHS contract should play by the rules they have signed up to.




Again - a product of the system.



That's the best plan.

Be aware also that no-one is registered with an NHS dentist anymore. A dentist is only responsible for you whilst you are under treatment. As soon as you have finished treatment, you are 'unregistered' again.

So, this dentist will see you for this appointment for the emergency treatment tonight, for which he will get 1 point. Now - that will be it for that treatment. If it is the same dentist who is 'taking you on' you will then go back for an examination, and it is there that the treatment will be discussed. When you have agreed the treatment, you will then make more appointments, and you will the be 'his' patient until that treatment is finished.

If he starts talking about stuff that will be done in a 'few months time' then he is probably splitting up the treatmnet, as if there is a gap in the treatment of more than 3 months, he can claim a fresh batch of points and make it more worthwhile.

Again, this is breaking the rules. As you don't pay the charges, this will make little difference to you though.

Maybe best to go with it. He does have a practice to run after all.

Well, apparently one dentist is taking people on, so if he/she is, then great.

I can see why dentists may not take on too many people, but then that doesn't help the patient. After my last dentist, my self esteem took a major battering, knowing my teeth weren't the same as they were when I went to see him. It's the patients that have to live with the rush jobs that some provide. I'm sure many are very good, but I had a right stinker last time out.

Thsi dentist tonight is a 'dental access centre' which treats emergencies and people with physical/mental problems before passing them on to an NHS dentist.

I don't need loads of work done, but I need a bit. As you say, i'm not paying at the moment, but I hope that will change very soon when re-build my life. If I can do that, i'd be very happy to be able to pay for my treatment :)

I'm not worried if i'm not paying that he wants to split things up. He may find I need more done than I think, and it's not as if anything apart from a coupl of things are visible or causing me pain. As long as I get my treatment and am treated well, then that's all I care about.

[Miroslav]

Well, it was 2 inflamations caused by a loose crown, which I didn't know was loose. Apparently it was digging into my mouth and causing it to swell up.

I now have some anti-biotics, one less crown, and still quite a bit of pain, but hopefully the swelling will decrease now.

[barber1982]

How you feeling today any better ?:D

[Miroslav]

I'm not in pain at the moment and one inflamation has all but gone already, the other is still there, but last night my mouth bled and bled, and I collapsed :( Luckily I was just about to get back in bed, so I collapsed there and I woke up about an hour ago.

Not sure if it was due to losing so much blood, the anti-biotics or the stronger painkillers.

Thanks for asking

[Toothsmith]

Doubt it would be blood loss Miroslav.

8pts is a hell of a lot to come out of a bit of swollen gum.

Bleeding in the mouth always mixes with the saliva and looks like 10x more than there really is.

Probably more likely to be lack of sleep combined with the painkillers combined with the reief that it didn't hurt so much anymore combined with the panic at seeing all that red stuff!

Glad you're on the mend.

[Miroslav]

Doubt it would be blood loss Miroslav.

8pts is a hell of a lot to come out of a bit of swollen gum.

Bleeding in the mouth always mixes with the saliva and looks like 10x more than there really is.

Probably more likely to be lack of sleep combined with the painkillers combined with the reief that it didn't hurt so much anymore combined with the panic at seeing all that red stuff!

Glad you're on the mend.

I've no doubt you are right, it made me panic a bit and when I started feeling lightheaded, I was very worried.

I prefer this weak feeling to the pain though, so look on the bright side :o

[pollocmc]

The simplest thing the dentist could do would be to take out every tooth with a problem and provide a denture. This would get him maximum points for minimum outlay.


Risk of a professional misconduct case there. The treatment has to be appropriate and surely extractions are not always appropriate. I know in a lot of cases you could argue the toss.

see http://www.gdc-uk.org/General+public/Conduct+hearings/ if you don't believe me.

What really needs to happen is that dentists are properly rewarded for remaining in the NHS and private practice doesn't seem such an attractive alternative and not driven by piece-work targets.



Be careful to discuss all alternatives with him, and come up with a treatment plan you are happy with (Of course - you may well be happy with that option).

Great advice. Make sure you know what is going on and attend all your appointments now that you are on a list. Two strikes and you'll be out!

My initial reaction in your situation (unregistered and no-one willing to take you on) would have been to visit A&E if you are in that much pain - all dental pain is agony :) and no-one wants to listen. Are you near a Dental School? Do they not have dental A&E there?

Here's a wee bit (from the scotsman newspaper )about A&E provision up here.

"NHS Grampian operates what is calls the GDENS service for out-of-hours dental treatment, which operates from 6:15pm to 9:15pm, Monday to Friday and from 9:30am to 12:30pm at the weekend.

The Glasgow Emergency Dental Service, based at the Dental Hospital in the city, provides coverage for everybody in the Greater Glasgow health board area during weekday evenings and throughout the weekend.

Meanwhile, in Dundee, a walk-in clinic operates from 9:30am to 11:30am on Saturday and Sunday at the city's Ninewells Hospital.

NHS Ayrshire & Arran offers a community emergency dental service to unregistered patients, which operates every afternoon from Ayr Hospital. "

[Miroslav]

My initial reaction in your situation (unregistered and no-one willing to take you on) would have been to visit A&E if you are in that much pain - all dental pain is agony :) and no-one wants to listen. Are you near a Dental School? Do they not have dental A&E there?



A&E apologised and sent me packing with the same telephone number I got no answer from, although they eventually called me back. Seems my local A&E couldn't help.

Dental School? Is that the same as a Dental Access Centre? That's where I eventually got treated.

[Toothsmith]

No - a dental school is where we are taught to do it properly! A training hospital for undergraduate dentists. They too are short of funds, and can't really operate a dental A&E service for the demand around them. There have been reports in the press recently about the queues that form outside Manchester dental hospital on a daily basis.

Pollocmc :-

I agree entirely that if an extraction were done inappropriately, a service case could follow.

The way this dental contract is laid down though, dentists on the NHS are having to tread the tightrope between Bankruptcy on one side and professional ethics on the other. Some find it a bit too easy for my liking though!

[Miroslav]

I was talking to the dentist about the new NHS charges etc. She was really friendly and talked me through the whole process and was evening joking with me.