Mouth Ulcers

[Poppy9]

My DD (11) has a nasty mouth ulcer on the inside of her mouth by her bottom teeth. She has had this for about 5 days now and it's not clearing. She is in pain with it so I've given her some Ibrofen (and told her to rub some directly onto it) but wondered if anyone had any homemade remedies. I remember being plagued with them at the same age and tried salt, vinger, bicab etc but don't remember them working. I've done a quick google and didn't find anything useful. Any ideas appreciated as she keeps coming to sit on my lap crying with the pain. :(

Thanks

[savvy]

Well I'm just watching Big Brother and Nikki has had the same thing.................the BB dentist has advised her to gargle as much as possible with warm salt water......erm HTH :confused:;)

[pink_phantom]

If it has been there for any good length of time I would take her to the doctors beause mouth ulcers can become infected and may need anti biotics to clear them up.

[Poppy9]

If it has been there for any good length of time I would take her to the doctors beause mouth ulcers can become infected and may need anti biotics to clear them up.

Thanks for the reply but I don't really want her to have antibiotics. I have taken a bit to heart bad press of over exposure to antibiotics so we try to avoid them whenever possible but then I'm thinking of my brother who developed a problem after having a tooth removed recently. Developed an infection which led to an absess on his windpipe and an emergency operation.

Just been reading a bit more on the web and it seems it might not be healing because of her crooked bottom teeth. These really bother her and are intermittently painful. Her dentist (who she only saw 4 weeks ago) says it's a bit early to start straightening them out as she hasn't lost all her back teeth yet (only 1 gone and 1 wobbly). This rung a bell with me as I had problems with teeth around the time of having mouth ulcers and switched dentists (to the one my DD is with now) who said on first visit I needed teeth out and a brace as my mouth was severely overcrowded and I was developing lovely fangs! Poor DD maybe going the same route as overcrowded teeth run in my family (just like noses :) )

[soolin]

Does she get a lot of mouth ulcers or is this unusual? If she is prone to ulcers then it might be a symptom of something else like coeliac disease, but if it is a one off then try a medicated mouth wash (darn but I can't remember the name) from a chemist, It tastes foul but it really does work.

Soo

[Poppy9]

This is the first proper one. She's only ever had them on her tongue when she has bitten it. This is like a white blister on the inside of her lower lip.

[Andybez38]

Just get her to dab a bit of salt into it. :eek: Stings like hell but repeat every now and then. It has always got rid of mine and quiet quickly. :D

[Poppy9]

Just get her to dab a bit of salt into it. :eek: Stings like hell but repeat every now and then. It has always got rid of mine and quiet quickly. :D

Is that why you have a strange look on your face :rotfl:

I remember trying this as a child. Didn't work and blooming killed:eek:

[djl]

try salt that works for me it hurts but it works

[Andybez38]

[QUOTE=Poppy9]Is that why you have a strange look on your face :rotfl:

I might have that strange look on my face but i dont have mouth ulsers. That looks something totaly different. :D

[abbecer]

I've not done it myself but i have read several times that you should compress a cold used teabag against it. Don't know why it works, but apparently it does!! Hope this helps.

Rebecca x :rotfl:

[Poppy9]

I've not done it myself but i have read several times that you should compress a cold used teabag against it. Don't know why it works, but apparently it does!! Hope this helps.

Rebecca x :rotfl:

I suspect something to do with the Tannin (sp?) as it's also useful to put cold tea onto sunburn to take the sting out of it.

[Toothsmith]

Mouth ulcers are to dentistry what the common cold is to medicine. An annoying little !!!!!! that's far mor complex than it first appears!

The most common time to become prone to mouth ulcers is during times of hormonal change/imbalance. For us blokes, that's really only puberty and adolesence. For women, you can add pregnancy, menstrual cycle and (less common) menopause.

Judging by what teeth you said your daughter had lost Poppy, I would bet it's the first signs of puberty causing her ulcers, nothing more sinister.

Other factors in their appearence (I hesitate to call them causes, as they don't always appear with these things) are Vit B deficiency, Vit C deficiency (I bet Ted would link Vit D as well - certainly possible!) Iron deficiency, poor oral hygine, smoking, sharp/broken/crooked teeth (But the teeth would have to be very crooked, and possibly poor oral hygiene as well),bowel problems (as previously mentioned by someone else) overuse of NSAIDs (Ibuprofen & aspirin) but this would be very long term overuse, drug abuse, AIDS.

As I said though, your daughter is most likely pre-pubecent.

For 'cures' there really ain't much!

Salty mouthwashes are mildly antiseptic and can help, although they can sting like the devil on a ripe one, I'm not a big fan of other antiseptic mouthwashes as they can upset the natural flora of the mouth (The good bugs) and possibly then lead to more ulcers.

There is a good product called Difflam, which is an anaesthetic mouthwash and can make things more comfortable to eat/clean teeth/get to sleep. The mouthwash is best if there are multiple ulcers, there is a spray with a directional straw for use with single ulcers. Off the top of my head, I think this is only available for kids above 12 though.

For younger kids, Calgel is a good topical anaesthetic, and Bongela has it's uses, although I prefer Calgel.

There are various coating gels you can get as well, such as Orabase. But these are really fiddly to apply successfully, and often get washed off, or rubbed off before it can set.

Antibiotics should never be prescribed systemically (To be taken as tablets/medicine) for ulcers, although sometimes doctors do (That's the problem of only having 2 hour long lectures on mouth problems in their training!) Sometimes, an antibiotic mouthwash can help, but this is in rare instances.

For patients with real mega - bother from them, steroids can be prescribed, but that has it's own problems as well.

Neither, I'm afraid Poppy, should painkiller tablets be 'rubbed on'. Ibuprofen won't do much harm, but if it were an aspirin you tried, it could have caused a nasty acid burn. Painkillers work on the brain to reduce pain, not the site of the pain.

The bottom line is that treated, an ulcer will last for seven days, untreated, it will be gone in a week!

the best you can do is to make it more comfortable for the few days it is really ripe and sore.

If anyone has an ulcer for more than a fortnight, go and see your dentist. Oral cancers are relatively rare things, but they do exist and are becoming more common. If caught early, the 5 year survival rates are above 95%. If not caught early, they are less than 50%.

Hope this is helpful.

[Poppy9]

Other factors ........ smoking, I've been telling her for ages to give up the fags:rotfl:

For younger kids, Calgel is a good topical anaesthetic I will get some of this tomorrow as she is struggling to eat.

Neither, I'm afraid Poppy, should painkiller tablets be 'rubbed on'. Ibuprofen won't do much harm, but if it were an aspirin you tried, it could have caused a nasty acid burn. Painkillers work on the brain to reduce pain, not the site of the pain. It was syrup. She has a bit of an issue with tablets and can only swallow the very small clarityn. I thought it might work directly a bit like the Ibuprofen creme I use on my back (no - I wouldn't put that in her mouth:eek: ).

Hope this is helpful. Yes thanks.

Ps I know puberty is looming as she has blackhead and moods, didn't realise it could trigger mouth ulcers though.

[italiastar]

Just get her to dab a bit of salt into it. :eek: Stings like hell but repeat every now and then. It has always got rid of mine and quiet quickly. :D

I use a slice of lemon - again hurts like hell, but works.

[Nicki]

I went through a phase of bad mouth ulcers linked to crohn's disease, and chemist told me the best thing for them was Boots sore mouth gel (yes this was in Boots!). I did find it much more effective than Bongela, and much cheaper too. Things like salt gargles and TCP only hurt like mad, and made no difference to the healing time.

[robnye]

i have used,
rubbing the ulcer with some fresh garlic..... again it stings for a little while, but it does work

ensuring teeth are cleaned properly........ (touchy subject - with pubescent children - i know i've got 3 daughters)

sore mouth gel...... various, try the shop store make...... i think it can be used frequently.

[Savvy_Sue]

I was going to say that there are things the GP can prescribe other than antibiotics, but after Toothsmith's lecture there's really no need! :D I had a very bad one and had cortisone tablets which I had to place against it, tasted absolutely vile! Best thing I find is Anbesol, from the pharmacy. But it may be a case of 'suck it and see' with a few things like that!

[Poppy9]

Best thing I find is Anbesol, from the pharmacy.

Bought this for her yesterday. It helps her get through meal times. Hopefully it should start healing soon. Luckily she's not complaining when brushing her teeth and is still flossing the area it's just meal times.

[Ted_Hutchinson]

It may be worth boosting her immune system to reduce the chances of repeat ulcers.

Getting plenty of sunshine, at least the equivalent of 20 minutes full body exposure every day, will top up the vitamin d and this certainly helps with inflamation in the mouth and if she keeps up regular (non burning) exposure to sun at least until she's 19, this will reduce her chances of breast cancer in later life by 40%.

Zinc levels could be low and it wouldn't do any harm to use vitamin c and zinc tablets (aldi's are cheap). Boosting vitamin c by eating plenty of fruit and veg will help. The half life of vitamin c in the body is only around 30mins so it's best taken in small amounts every couple of hours (the 1g tablets can easily be snapped in half or even quartered) or use the slow release forms.
See also Do you get recurrent mouth ulcers? (http://www.mybodylanguage.co.uk/Mouthulcers1.htm)

[Poppy9]

Thanks Ted. She gets her sunshine allowance easily (especially the last week or so with this glorious weather). I also give her a decent multi vit/mineral tablet a day as she suffers with hayfever and I find it helps. In addition to this she has an Omega 3 oil tablet to stop a recurrance of Excema. Fresh fruit and veg intake is good. School banned junk a few years ago so it makes it easier to increase fruit/veg intake with breaktime snacks of these items. Also generally only drinks water throughout the day as fizzy drinks are for birthday and Xmas only (unless out for a meal).

Luckily she is a generally fit and healthy child so I guess it's either a virus that's triggered off the mouth ulcer (sick bug going around the school for last couple of weeks but she has avoided) or her hormones.

Today she has said that the pain is easing and the white head of the ulcer has gone (just a red raised lump left) so if she doesn' t eat her food tonight then it must be my cooking!!

[Toothsmith]

I think that was Orabase.

It's great if you can get it onto the ulcer and allow it to set.

This depends on the site of the ulcer, manual dexterity of the person putting it on, and or the co operation of the person having it put on!

You can also get Orabase with a bit of cortisone in it, which can speed up the healing a bit, but again, it depends how successfully you can apply it.

[Turning_into_scrooge]

I think that was Orabase.

It's great if you can get it onto the ulcer and allow it to set.

This depends on the site of the ulcer, manual dexterity of the person putting it on, and or the co operation of the person having it put on!

You can also get Orabase with a bit of cortisone in it, which can speed up the healing a bit, but again, it depends how successfully you can apply it.

I think this is the stuff i get on prescription from my doctor, it works brilliant but feels a bit yukky and dries your mouth out but if you can stand try it.

[Miroslav]

I asked the dentist I saw yesterday, and she said warm salt water, as suggested by others here.

[clairehas]

i really recommend the orabase as it is really sticky and does cover the ulcer!! just dont put your tongue on it as it tastes really weird!! i have a ulcer now and it does make you really miserable!

ive also tried coran pellets (or somethin like that) they are little tablets that you disolve around the ulcer - you take something like 4 a day for 5 days and it clears it up! this is a bit more difficult as you cant talk for a little while, but this might be a good thing!!!

hope this helps

[kit]

Just wanted to say thanks to everyone for their posts.... I knew i would find some help on this forum and a quick search found what I wanted!

I get a lot of mouth ulcers, at least a few a month, and never one on its own, always 2 or 3 at a time.

Am slowly working my way through the stuff available from chemists but not found anything that really works for me yet. Yesterday I was told by the pharmacist that i am not 'normal' and need to see a doctor about this.

After reading this post I am going to try taking some vitamins etc.... i have been anaemic a few times in the past so maybe its that causing them.

I'm just about willing to try anything...... I need to be able to eat!

[GemmaS]

Not sure if this will be any help but my hubby gets these and he went to the doctor who prescribed Difflam, it is a green mouthwash. It says it is for sore throats but worked wonders for him and it is available to buy from a chemist so does not need prescribing. Hope this is of some help.

[Savvy_Sue]

Am slowly working my way through the stuff available from chemists but not found anything that really works for me yet. Yesterday I was told by the pharmacist that i am not 'normal' and need to see a doctor about this.

After reading this post I am going to try taking some vitamins etc.... i have been anaemic a few times in the past so maybe its that causing them.

I'm just about willing to try anything...... I need to be able to eat!I hope that trying anything includes going to see your GP. As advised by your pharmacist ... There are prescription only medicines that can do the trick, but if there's an underlying cause then that needs to be addressed as well!

[homersimpson]

suggest you take her straight away to doctors and get some antibiotics (if doctor choose to perscribe them). it could turn into abcess and/or become infected.

[Toothsmith]

Doctors are generally pretty clueless about anything in the mouth. They 'Blind prescribe' a bit too often.

Difflam, for example just relieves symptoms. Was there any checking into an underlying cause?

See a dentist for better investigations. Or at least for someone who has a fair idea what may be going on!

P.S. Ulcers don't turn into abscesses, but abscesses are often mistaken for ulcers - esp by doctors!

[Teerah]

Much of the time recurrent ulcers have no obvious cause though and difflam can ease the pain, especially of the larger type, really well.

Rule of thumb, get any ulcer that has been present for three weeks or more checked out by your dentist. You can go to your GP also but they will more than likely advise a trip to the dentist anyway.

[kit]

I will go to the doctor when i get round to getting an appointment.
You have to start calling just before 8.30am..... after a few times trying and getting the engaged tone, you finally get through and are number 14 in the queue. You usually then wait for 30 mins only to be told no appointments left for that day!! oh.... and its an 0845 number which I beleive costs more than a normal number??


With regards to visiting a dentist - would love to but that will cost me money and I just cant afford it :confused:

[saubryn]

Some really interesting and informative posts in this thread! I hope your daughters ulcer is getting better, those things can really sting!

I'm worried now, I treat my ulcers by dabbing a little vodka on a clean finger and rubbing it on the ulcer. Stings like anything but usually makes them go away fast. Is that a 'valid' treatment?

[gingercordial]

From time to time I have periods of having lots of mouth ulcers, and very upsetting they are too, especially when you have several at once!

Not scientific, but I've noticed that they seem more likely to come on after sugar binges! Also if I'm very stressed at work (this also affects my digestion quite badly).

My dentist recommended chlorhexidine mouthwash, which works brilliantly, but then it stains my teeth something chronic so I only use it if they're really bad. Bongela's reasonably effective but wears off too soon. Salt water is OK. I've found a really hot cup of tea numbs the pain for some time afterwards!

[Poppy9]

I treat my ulcers by dabbing a little vodka on a clean finger and rubbing it on the ulcer. Stings like anything but usually makes them go away fast. Is that a 'valid' treatment?

I think it works better if you then drink the rest of the bottle of Vodka. It will compeletly dull the pain and make you loooooooooove everyone:D

[purplepatch]

Just wanted to add to this old thread to say that I did a search on mouth ulcers today and found excellent info here. I managed to scrape my lower gum directly below bottom two centre teeth at the weekend whilst brushing and now I have a row of about 5 evil ulcers that were making me so miserable. Having read this thread, I've bought some Adcortyl in Orabase gel and it really does work. I've tried so many different things over the years as I suffer quite badly and this is the first thing that has really made a difference. So thank you thank you thank you to everyone who mentioned it :D:D:D

Might also give the difflam a go. Does anyone know if the two are ok to combine?

[Toothsmith]

Orabase forms a coating over the ulcer, so the Difflam wouldn't penetrate that and do any good, other than numbing the rest of your mouth - which is a bit useless!

So although they don't interact in any nasty way, I would use one or the other depending on the situation, not both together.

If you used the Difflam BEFORE the Orabase, I suppose it would be OK though.

[purplepatch]

I got some difflam too as can only apply this cortisone orabase stuff 3 times a day and it does wear off between applications. The difflam made my mouth sting a bit, but I soaked a cotton wool ball in it and applied it directly to the ulcers which worked well.

Healing time is far quicker than usual too, already seeing a vast improvement - usually my ulcers last over a week at the mega painful stage.

So if anyone stumbles across this thread in desperation - I can heartily recommend these 2 products :D

Adcortyl in orabase £4ish
Difflam £7ish

If you can only afford one - make it the orabase.

[Toothsmith]

You can get Difflam as a directional spray as well.

If it does make your mouth sting, you can dilute it a bit, but your idea of soaking a cotton bud and holding it on the ulcer is good too.

[mioliere]

I was told years ago to rub a piece of cheese on an ulcer and, although it sounds strange, it always works for me!

[Toothsmith]

Wouldn't harm anything, but I suspect it's a bit of placebo effect going on here!