Gum problems please help

[winniepooh]

I stoppped smoking about 4 months ago now. Since then my gums have been bleeding.....quite badly at time and I have 2 sore areas. I wasn't due to see my dentist until August but I was really concerned about my gums so I rang the dentists and managed to get an appointment but it wasn't with my usual dentist its a private dentist.

I'm 29 but gum problems run in the family, my brother in 35 and wears full dentures and my dad has dentures but has had gum problems for as long as I can remember.


Too cut a long story short i'm that scared i'm going to loose all my teeth now I thought i'd come on here and ask for some advice. The dentist has told me I have gum disease and quite servere measuring a 3/4 on their probe thing. They gave me a light clean and polish and a scan but they what to refer me to a hospital for a review. They have given me anti biotics to take and have told me to corsadol. They said there maybe a long waiting list for the hospital. i'm scared that this problem is going to get much worse before I get an appointment.


So i'm after tips on how to try and control (if you can). Any tips at all. I'm so frightened that I think I walked out of the dentists in a daize to be honest. :eek:

[Mrs P Pincher]

I was told that when I stopped smoking my gums would get worse before they got better - and they did. Now they are better than they've ever been (and I'm smoking again!). I am 54 and have had gum disease since my teens, although no-one can tell me why.

I brush twice a day, floss in the evening, use an alcohol free mouthwash and take 100 mg CoQ10 every day. I also visit the hygienist every three months and once in a while I have a deep scale and polish under local anaesthetic. It's a pain and I have to keep on top of it, but I've only lost two teeth and it's one in the eye for the dentist who threw me out of his surgery 12 years ago refusing to treat me and saying that in 10 years time I wouldn't have any teeth!

After five years of this regime some of my 3/4s are now showing 2/3 and nothing is getting worse.

I'm with Denplan and pay something like £17 per month, which I don't notice as I pay by direct debit and that covers pretty much all my treatment.

Try not to panic. Gum disease is very common and a good dentist will work with you to manage it.

Mrs P P

[londoner1998]

hello!
I subscribe to all of Miss Penny P's tips. It is very important you keep on top of it. Eat well, plenty of fruit and veg, you need the vitamines. Stay away from the cigarrettes and alcohol, and also avoid sugary stuff. Since I had my upper wisdoms out two years ago, I have been very scrupulous with my dental hygiene, and it really shows. I do like Penny P does and I find that the flossing is fundamental- two days without it and my gums start bleeding. But do follow your specialist's advice if yours are delicate at the moment. Finish the antibiotics and remember that if you are using Corsodil, it stains your teeth dreadfully. My dentist recommended salty (boiled) warm water instead (even though he sold Corsodil himself in the surgery) - it keeps your gums clean very nicely and doesn't dry your mouth like the Corsodil does. I also use an ayurvedic power - Vico- It is all natural herbs used for their antiseptic and anti-inflammatory properties and very cheap. I use it as an overhaul if I have neglected my routine a bit, and once every week or two (just rub on the gums for a couple of minutes, leave it on for about five and the rinse). I get it in India or in the Yogamatters' website- www.yogamatters.com (http://www.yogamatters.com).

I do agree that you need to keep going to the hygienist for regular deep clean ups and maintain a thorough routine at home.
But don't worry, you are young and are dealing with it, so I woudln't panic, you certainly caught it on time!

[Keeping Motivated]

Do you use an electric toothbrush? My gums have improved loads since using one.

[winniepooh]

Thanks for all your replies. You've made me feel a bit calmer about it now. I left the dentists in tears this morning:(

Yes I use an electric tooth brush. I brush 3 times a day and use mouthwash. I also use listerine after eating aswell. I'm taking vit C & Q10.

I'm nervous about going to the hospital. Have any of you had to have an hospital appointment for this? Or do you think its because I'm young.

[Toothsmith]

I am 54 and have had gum disease since my teens, although no-one can tell me why.


Because you smoke?

[Toothsmith]

I stoppped smoking about 4 months ago now. Since then my gums have been bleeding.....quite badly at time and I have 2 sore areas. I wasn't due to see my dentist until August but I was really concerned about my gums so I rang the dentists and managed to get an appointment but it wasn't with my usual dentist its a private dentist.

I'm 29 but gum problems run in the family, my brother in 35 and wears full dentures and my dad has dentures but has had gum problems for as long as I can remember.


Too cut a long story short i'm that scared i'm going to loose all my teeth now I thought i'd come on here and ask for some advice. The dentist has told me I have gum disease and quite servere measuring a 3/4 on their probe thing. They gave me a light clean and polish and a scan but they what to refer me to a hospital for a review. They have given me anti biotics to take and have told me to corsadol. They said there maybe a long waiting list for the hospital. i'm scared that this problem is going to get much worse before I get an appointment.


So i'm after tips on how to try and control (if you can). Any tips at all. I'm so frightened that I think I walked out of the dentists in a daize to be honest. :eek:


By giving up smoking, you've done the biggest thing you can to help save your teeth.

I can't say if it's been caught in time or not without seeing you - but if it can be turned around, then good cleaning by you, regular hygienist/dental appointments and staying off the fags are all vital.

Gums often seem to get worse a few weeks after giving up - but that's not the case.

The nicotine in the plaque up against your teeth acts as a slow-release poison. This cuts down the blood supply to the area around your gums and starves them of oxygen - accelerating any tissue/bone loss in the area.

When you stop - the nicotine runs out and a blood supply comes back to the area. This then means that the inflamed gums bleed again - which they wouldn't have been doing before.

Ideally, the gums would not be bleeding. It's a sign of inflammation and gum disease after all. But that bleeding SHOULD have been happening beforehand, it was just being masked because of the lack of blood in the tissues.

As you and the dentist get to grips with things - this will lessen.

I'm not sure why you'll have been referred to the hospital - it may well be because you're very young to have advanced gum disease (Which is what it will be with scores of 3 or 4 all round.) But You'll find out when you go.

It's always a good idea to write down a list of questions before you go to these places. It can be an intimidating experience, and you can easily forget some of the things you wanted to ask. Don't be afraid to write down some of the answers as well. Again - it's easy to forget.

The most important thing though is to stay off the ciggys. If you go back to them, it won't be so much a question of if you need dentures, but when.

[Mrs Money]

I second the advice about electric toothbrushes (and so do my 2 most recent dentists) plus all the flossing and mouthwash etc, but the electric toothbrush is the best investment for your teeth that you can make - apart from good dentistry of course!
Plus when you use it, keep the brush still over the flat surface of each tooth for 3 seconds, then over the place where tooth joins gum for 3 seconds - it's supposed to improve gum health very quickly.
Don't panic and don't give up - you can manage this problem.

[larmy16]

Toothsmith. May I ask if there are smokers who do not get gum disease and if not why?

You see a lot of celebrities who are heavy smokers eg. Kate Moss/Jodie Marsh and they have gleaming white teeth and full gums, not receding. I appreciate that they are probably veneers on their teeth and they can afford to have them replaced as and when.

What makes one smoker vulnerable to gum disease and yet another not? Is is hereditary and in your genes to some extent? Also what is the minimum time for untreated gingivitis to go to full blown gums receding gum disease. Sorry a lot of questions I know.:o

[Essex Maid]

Most important thing is you have taken action! My sister had this prob, and the dentist just fobbed her off for a couple of years. Different dentist referred her to a hospital, she had to wait a while, but the treatment is free and it is been a lot of appointments BUT treatment is working, and she is a lot older than you.

[Toothsmith]

98% of the population have 'gum disease' to one degree or another. Frm on little bleeding bit of gum against a single tooth to gross generalised bone loss and teeth swaying around in the breeze.

Kate & Jodie good teeth? - Not if you know what you're looking for, and see 'in the raw' shots rather than digitally enhanced ones.

Anything to do with the body affects one person differently to another - be it something bad for you or something good for you.

Smoking affects the gums of the vast majority of people who do it to one degree or another, and it's usually a pretty high degree.

Who can say what factors are at play when it affects one person more than another? - It's likely to be many factors really.

Smoking though is responsible for the death of half the people who do it, and very very few of them go to the grave with all their teeth!

[larmy16]

Thanks Toothsmith for all that information. Yes I did forget to say that their pics are probably enhanced. It is interesting to see the older films and tv series from the seventies, that lots of the people had natural teeth, eg slightly yellowed and not tombstone straight even in the States!

[Toothsmith]

I always tell my female smoking patients to stick a photo of June Brown (Dot Cotton) in the corner of their mirror.

She has the typical female smoker face.

Her teeth have radically 'improved' since the early days of Eastenders - but I'd be very surprised if they're anything other than an expensive set of falsies now.

[Mrs P Pincher]

Touch! Toothsmith, but I have had chronic gum disease from about the age of 15, before I ever smoked, and no-one has ever suggested smoking is the cause - when I say, why me? they say they just don't know. All I know is when I stopped smoking it got a lot worse...

Mrs P P

[winniepooh]

Touch! Toothsmith, but I have had chronic gum disease from about the age of 15, before I ever smoked, and no-one has ever suggested smoking is the cause - when I say, why me? they say they just don't know. All I know is when I stopped smoking it got a lot worse...

Mrs P P


Same as my dad, he had it from a teenager too. He has never smoked tho or drank.

[Teerah]

There are genetic factors at play too.

Also the different bacteria that are in peoples mouths, some of these are heavily involved in gum destruction. Not all gum disease is treatable given these variances.

[floyd]

Winniepooh, please try not to panic. I was reading similar 3's and 4's at the age of 27 but after 4 years of intensive root planing at a hospital Peridontal Clinic and meticulous brushing (Oral B oscillating brush), flossing and bottlebrushing (TePe) coupled with additional hygenist visits with my own dentist I have now been discharged from the clinic and my gums are stable.
However, this is a lifelong commitment. I still have 3 hygenist visits and 2 dental appointments a year and have to maintain a strict routine of brush/floss/TePe twice a day otherwise I am back to square 1.
One of the surgeons took an interest in my case at the Hospital as my gum disease was incredibly advanced for someone so young who didn't smoke and brushed their teeth regularly and according to him 'did a pretty good job' with it. He seemed to think in my case it could be related strongly to autoimmune factors as there are close family links to rheumatoid arthritis, lupus and bullous pemphigoid.

That aside, there is no substitute for immaculate oral hygene. Good luck :)

[Toothsmith]

Touch! Toothsmith, but I have had chronic gum disease from about the age of 15, before I ever smoked, and no-one has ever suggested smoking is the cause - when I say, why me? they say they just don't know. All I know is when I stopped smoking it got a lot worse...

Mrs P P

Did you read my post #7? It would just have appeared to have got worse when you stopped.

There are some people who are just genetically prone to gum disease. But in every case, smoking would increase the damage and rate of destruction, not improve it.

[Toothsmith]

Same as my dad, he had it from a teenager too. He has never smoked tho or drank.


You don't have to smoke or drink to get gum disease, just as many non-smoking teatotallers get cancer.

But you are much much more likely to get a destructive, progressive gum disease if you smoke.

Also, it's much harder to control/manage/cure in smokers.

There are many periodontists (gum specialist dentists) who don't even bother - they claim it's just a waste of everybodies time and money, and the sooner a smoker is onto dentures the better for everybody - including the patient.

[moomin_white]

So i'm after tips on how to try and control (if you can). Any tips at all. I'm so frightened that I think I walked out of the dentists in a daize to be honest. :eek:

i see you are using an electric toothbrush which is excellent. But don't rely too heavily on mouthwashes to be effective. What it appears you are missing out on in interdental cleaning -cleaning inbetween the teeth. No electric toothbrush or mouthwash will do this. So you really need to start cleaning inbetween your teeth aswell.

Type 'how to floss' into a search engine if you don't know how to floss. When you start flossing your gums will bleed, but because you will be removing more plaque germs, the bleeding will reduce. Butit does sound like you also need the help of a hygienist to remove any hard deposits of tartar.

But at the end of the day, the onus is on you and your oral hygiene!

Good luck with it all :)

[Kantankrus Mare]

Read this post with interest as I have been having treatment every three months at the dentist for the last couple of years.

Have been very scrupulous with my oral hygiene for the last three months and using interdental brushes, mouthwash etc so was hoping for some improvement.

Was absolutely gutted when I heard the hygienist saying 6's and 7's for some areas of my mouth. could have cried.

Im a non smoker, have never smoked and eat pretty healthily.

She brought the main dentist through and they explained that the next step would be to refer me to a specialist as they had done all the treatment they could do.

The nearest one is in Leeds. A round trip of four hours :eek:

Obviously will cost me as well. Hundreds probably.

Dont know what Im doing wrong? :confused:

Hygienist said Im doing a good job of cleaning them as their isnt much tartar but has booked me in for another three months time to deep scrape the problem areas.

I have some Q10 in cupboard which I am going to start taking regularly and try to further improve my veg and fruit intake.

Not sure what else I can do? :confused:

[Teerah]

Read this post with interest as I have been having treatment every three months at the dentist for the last couple of years.

Have been very scrupulous with my oral hygiene for the last three months and using interdental brushes, mouthwash etc so was hoping for some improvement.

Was absolutely gutted when I heard the hygienist saying 6's and 7's for some areas of my mouth. could have cried.

Im a non smoker, have never smoked and eat pretty healthily.

She brought the main dentist through and they explained that the next step would be to refer me to a specialist as they had done all the treatment they could do.

The nearest one is in Leeds. A round trip of four hours :eek:

Obviously will cost me as well. Hundreds probably.

Dont know what Im doing wrong? :confused:

Hygienist said Im doing a good job of cleaning them as their isnt much tartar but has booked me in for another three months time to deep scrape the problem areas.

I have some Q10 in cupboard which I am going to start taking regularly and try to further improve my veg and fruit intake.

Not sure what else I can do? :confused:

Once bone loss has occurred, it will never grow back and repair to its original levels so its a case of maintenance at your current levels. What you should find is a decrease in inflammation and this is a sign that the process is slowing down/ stopping.

If it has only been 3 months since you have been cleaning scrupulously then it is possibly too early to tell whether or not you can control it longterm.

[moomin_white]

Read this post with interest as I have been having treatment every three months at the dentist for the last couple of years.

Have been very scrupulous with my oral hygiene for the last three months and using interdental brushes, mouthwash etc so was hoping for some improvement.

Was absolutely gutted when I heard the hygienist saying 6's and 7's for some areas of my mouth. could have cried.

Im a non smoker, have never smoked and eat pretty healthily.

She brought the main dentist through and they explained that the next step would be to refer me to a specialist as they had done all the treatment they could do.

The nearest one is in Leeds. A round trip of four hours :eek:

Obviously will cost me as well. Hundreds probably.

Dont know what Im doing wrong? :confused:

Hygienist said Im doing a good job of cleaning them as their isnt much tartar but has booked me in for another three months time to deep scrape the problem areas.

I have some Q10 in cupboard which I am going to start taking regularly and try to further improve my veg and fruit intake.

Not sure what else I can do? :confused:

one thing to get straight is that tartar isn't the cause of the pocketing -tartar is calcified plaque thus is dead and doesn't damage the gums. What it does do is create more surface area for the plaque (live bacteria) to accumulate.

Are the interdental brushes you are using snuggly fitting in all the spaces? if they are too small they won't remove all the bacteria. The other thing i get my patients to use if brushing and id brushes aren't working, is a single tufted brush (i will private message you with a link that shows you how to use). This looks like a artists paintbrush and where there are deep pockets -i advise for this to be aimed up into the gum margin and used in a circular brushing motion.

I have found this works pretty well -but can be a bit tedoius to do(however worth it!)

some people are susceptible to gum disease and to the various extents, but it's worth continuing to keep on top of your oral hygiene and not to get despondent

[Kantankrus Mare]

Thanks for the info moomin.......this brush could well be helpful to me as its right at the back Im struggling with.

After reading up on here and other sights I also think I have been using the brushes in between my teeth wrong.

I have been pushing them through once......not backwards and forwards several times.

Making me paranoid.

Is it sensible to clean teeth straight after eating or to wait half an hour or so?

Teerah....I have been having treatment for two years and will agree I have not been consistent with the scrupulous cleaning till the last three months.

Will carry on with a vengeance now. Having seen what it may cost me to see a specialist in gum disease :eek:

[Teerah]

I cant help feel there has been a failure on the part of who is treating you if they have not ensured you are using the brushes properly when you have been receiving treatment for two years now