the NHS

[digp]

does anyone have any tips / experiences of "jumping" queues to see consultants / getting transferred out of town where waiting list is shorter / going abroad for treatment because list is too long ?

if so, please post your tips / experiences here.

[krisskross]

Only thing I can suggest is to see the consultant of your choice privately. Make sure s/he works within the NHS as well. Then if anything is required after the initial paid for consultation you can transfer back into the NHS with the same consultant.

[penrhyn]

krisscross makes a good point, we did this with my mum, a private appointment was followed up in a matter of days with the necessary tests in the NHS hospital.

A private consultation will cost around £150, but you could check first.

[highet]

com[plain to your local MP - they then write to chief exec of trust demanding to know why one of their constituents are being made to wait/what the hells going on etc etc - chief exec writes to consultant saying '' see this person at once as i have local MP on my back'' - voila you jump the queue - just a shame about all the other poor !!!!!!s who have to wait even longer

[goldentouch]

Go to BUPA and have a private consultation. Yoy save time waiting for referral and also because they will tell you where the shortest list is in your area and you can choose to go there.

[Dora the Explorer]

Paying for a private consultation and then using the nhs is excellent advice.
Patients will probably want to talk to their GP about which consultant would be best for, sorry can't remember if the GP has to write a referral letter as well. A GP will also know which of the nhs hospitals which he can refer people to has the shortest waiting list for particular conditions.
Having written this, I'm hoping I've got it right. Things in the nhs are changing so rapidly at the moment -Payment By Results, Choose and Book (known in the trade as choose, book and cancel), hospitals delaying things for financial reasons, or even cutting back and cutting out - that trying to keep up to date with what's what in the nhs is like herding cats.
Many people go abroad for treatment and have varying experiences. Many people pay for their treatment in the uk and have varying experiences. However, should anything go wrong the good old nhs usually picks up the pieces.

[Savvy_Sue]

Once you're in the system, PALS (Patient Advice and Liaison Service) are definitely worth using if things seem to be stalling or going wrong! Every hospital should have one!

[Spendless]

Agree with other, pay privately for a consultation and then nhs, or if you can afford it and need to, go pay for each step privately, only going to the nhs when you can no longer afford not to.

I'm in BUPA via hubbys work and when it was first spotted I had a hearing problem I went to consultant private. I could then go nhs or private for the MRI I was sent to, a benign tumour was my problem and I was sent to see a professor and again the choice. Another consultant nearer to my home and again the choice and then private or nhs for the op. I went private all the way for this as BUPA covered it, but it would have been a lot of nhs lists to be on.

4 years on and BUPA have decided not to cover me for my annual MRI :mad: as they say it is monitoring and also they don't cover anything benign-which makes no sense at all because the condition is always benign and they found it on their database :rolleyes: , so it's back to the NHS for me. Thankfully I chose the hospital and consultant who did both NHS and private work so I don't have to change.

[Dora the Explorer]

Absolutely right, Sue. Unfortunately PALS can be a bit patchy, at one hospital near me PALS support is a leaflet stand and a telephone number. I have heard of good and bad experiences with PALS in other health 'patches', so it can be the luck of the draw. Maybe a good gp/patient relationship is the best help and support for anyone.

[ribenagirl]

If you can afford it, do pay for a private initial consultation as many of the others have said. It does work.

Alternatively, if you can't afford to do this, pester your GP as much as is humanly possible. When GP's refer, they usually specify how urgent *they* think it is. If they're requesting an urgent/ soon appt, sometimes we take notice, sometimes we don't, as this is one of the areas when we use our clinical judgement to decide on the patient's behalf. But if a GP has marked you down as routine, then we *always* go with what the GP says for obvious reasons!!

So, check with your GP in the first instance to find out what priority they referred you as. Second, tell them your symptoms have worsened and ask them to write again to escalate your appointment.

Thirdly, we do take notice if individuals ring up and tell us their symptoms have worsened and how much longer are they going to have to wait. GP referral information is often inadequate at best, yet we are expected to decide how urgently someone needs seeing on the basis of what the GP writes, so to get more details from the patient direct can often help us decide how urgent someone really is.

So you could try ringing the consultant's secretary direct and asking how long you will have to wait. He or she won't have the authority to make that decision so she'll have to get your notes and pass on your phone message to the consultant or one of their registrars, so at least it means that someone will look at your case instead of just waiting for it to come to the top of the list.

HTH!

Oh, forgot to say. In the next couple of years, techically your GP will be able to look on their computer, see what consultants are available within a certain radius, see who's got the shortest waiting lists, and if you agree, send you there even if it's out of town. Being on the other end of that system, I am loathing and dreading it as it has not been properly thought through, but that's a different story. At the moment, your GP will only have a contract with their local healthcare provider to treat you, and you *can* get referred elsewhere, but they'll have to pay for your treatment which obviously they can't often afford, so they keep quiet about it :)

[digp]

ribenagirl: are you a consultant...?

[Savvy_Sue]

Absolutely right, Sue. Unfortunately PALS can be a bit patchy, at one hospital near me PALS support is a leaflet stand and a telephone number. I have heard of good and bad experiences with PALS in other health 'patches', so it can be the luck of the draw. But I'm sure someone told me that if there wasn't a PALS at your hospital, you should let the local patient body know - I don't remember the right name - because it was a legal requirement! I know when I first rang there was a staff vacancy and the existing staff member was on holiday so it's hard to deal with that, but there was at least information on the answerphone about where to get help / who to contact in different situations.

Maybe a good gp/patient relationship is the best help and support for anyone.Yup, nothing beats it!

[Dora the Explorer]

You're right Sue - but the PALS worker dedicated hours can be at the discretion of the hospital trust so they can use a leaflet stand and a phone number/answerphone. Nigel Crisp - of blessed memory - recently instructed Trusts not to do any 'discretionary' work unless it was clinically vital, and some Trusts may decide to run a minimum PALS service rather than close beds/delay surgery etc.
I think the patient body you're thinking of is is Commission for Public and Patient Involvement which is the national organisation, and due to be taken behind the barn and shot in the head sometime this year if nhs rumours are right, and they often are. No doubt it will be replaced by something else.
The only PALS service I have come across that I would be confident using is run on contract by a volunatry sector organisation.
Excellent advice from Ribenagirl - I know two Trust chief executives who have done exactly what she suggests.I nsider knowledge ?
For anyone who's thinking about having any procedure at a non nhs hospital: ask them how they handle unplanned for events, like for instance cardiac emergencies, both for day patients and overnighters.

[digp]

Isn't it the case that GPs are a classic example of mediocrity?

[Savvy_Sue]

Isn't it the case that GPs are a classic example of mediocrity?:confused: Not sure what you're saying, but with my family I've had EXCELLENT GP care, at least for the last 20 years, they've known when to refer me on but I couldn't have asked for better treatment within the surgery. There's also been an excellent book serialised on Radio 4 this week, Surburban Shaman, and he compared the treatment you get from a GP to what you get from a consultant - the GP gets a long term, broad picture, whereas the specialist only really gets a snapshot. Yes, sometimes you need the snapshot, examining part of your body in depth, but I don't need to be referred to a neurologist for my headaches if they're down to depression, or my hormones, and you can get to see a GP rather quicker than you can a neurologist anyway!

[mrseyes]

I have heard this where patient goes for private consultation and jump the nhs queues. But i have also heard that now hospital management are checking on and questioning about this practice. For instance if pt who require a cataract operation, seen privately and then tranfered to nhs, they do not have priority over nhs pts and would be treated like any other nhs pts.

[Dora the Explorer]

Paying for a private consultation and then having treatment on the nhs doesn't mean one would jump the queue for treatment -the nhs treats people according to clinical need. It enables people to avoid the waiting list for a first consultation.

[ceebeeby]

Hello,

Just to join the debate, in theory the NHS have systems that mean private patients CANNOT jump any queues. You would have to be registered as an NHS patient to use NHS equipment otherwise you wouldn't be insured etc. If your Consultant was happy to sneak you in the back door and was then found out - he would be disciplined at the very least.

The suggestion to go to your MP seemed slightly premature, firstly it wouldn't get you anywhere higher up the list (unless your consultant is after something politically!!), and secondly, if everyone did this, you'd be right back at the beginning.

With new waiting times regulations you MUST be seen at present within 18 weeks of appt in England and 26 weeks in Scotland (although this changes to 18 next year). You are perfectly entitled to phone up your hospital and find out where you are on the list.

Additionally, if your symptoms have altered since you saw your GP you should either go back to him / her, or if you are in pain you should go to your local Casualty Department where you can explain about your referral and request to be seen there and then.

Part of patient choice is being seen where you want to be seen, which means if you are not satisfied with the service of your local hospital, then you can investigate other NHS hospitals that have shorter waiting times and attend for your treatment there.

HTH

[Toothsmith]

Anyone interested in where the NHS is going should read THIS BOOK (http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/1844675394/qid=1142437678/sr=8-1/ref=sr_8_xs_ap_i1_xgl/026-2557355-6262817).

As someone who's seen the REAL agenda of Government NHS policy first hand, I can thoroughly recommend it.

[digp]

the NHS is farce

[RACHIE77]

Oh, forgot to say. In the next couple of years, techically your GP will be able to look on their computer, see what consultants are available within a certain radius, see who's got the shortest waiting lists, and if you agree, send you there even if it's out of town. Being on the other end of that system, I am loathing and dreading it as it has not been properly thought through, but that's a different story. At the moment, your GP will only have a contract with their local healthcare provider to treat you, and you *can* get referred elsewhere, but they'll have to pay for your treatment which obviously they can't often afford, so they keep quiet about it :)

Is this what you mean??

There is a system called Choose and Book that is in operation now but the GP has to have signed up to it to enable you to be able to be part of the scheme... I think that the idea is that GPs will be signing up to it as part of offering patients more choice, it is in operation in some areas but I guess you would know if your GP had signed up as they would tell you when they needed to get you in for an op...

More info here (http://www.chooseandbook.nhs.uk/patients)