Cutting it fine with MOT/Tax - Reassure me!

[BigBouncyBall]

Hi

I'm a bit nervous about my MOT - i've left it too late, it expired in the middle of June but as i bought the car 12 months ago (this week) i thought the MOT was done when i bought it but i've checked the certificate and it's expired.

So i've booked in for an MOT for this Tuesday (£42 from a well reguarded local MOT centre!) but the tax is due for the end of this month. Will I have time to get the tax disc

a) if it passes the MOT
b) if it fails the MOT

I think if it passes i'll be OK as i cn rush down to the post office and get it done that afternoon but if it fails, i'm going to be struggling to get the repairs done in time for the tax disc renewal aren't I?

PANIC!

[Hintza]

Well you can't tax it without an MOT cert. Therefore it is imperative that you get the MOT. You will have to make up your own mind whether the MOT centre repairs it if it needs anything. Personally I would tell them to carry out any minor repairs straightaway but to give you a call if it needs anything big.

Assuming it doesn't pass then don't panic just don't drive it on the road until its fixed if you aren't driving it you shouldn't run in to any problems with the tax. Just tax it as soon as its MOT'd if a big problem then declare SORN until repaired.

If I was in your shoes I would just stick it in to get MOT'd and repaired as necessary.

[davetrousers]

Hi
but if it fails, i'm going to be struggling to get the repairs done in time for the tax disc renewal aren't I?



Well you would just get road tax when the car has its retake and passes. You can 't use the car anyway if it hasn't got an MOT.

[Wig]

You can be (officially) 14 days late to tax your vehicle, so 14th August, but in practice, as long as it is done and registered on the DVLA computer before the end of August. You won't have any problem in relation to the DVLA £80 automatic fine for not renewing VED. I personally would not let it go into the 4th week without renewing it.


This does not mean you are legal to drive the car on the road with No VED. Your MOT is on Tuesday 29th, you then have VED for Wednesday and Thursday, with which you can obviously drive around as normal - actually you can't because you have no MOT :D so don't drive the car except as follows.........

You can only drive to/from the MOT station, to your home or to a place of repair, but the repair must be booked and must be for the repair of a failed MOT item.

If you fail on a free retest item(s) within 24hours feel free to take your vehicle away for repair and return next day.

If it takes longer to repair, you can still drive it with no VED to/from your home to the MOT station or to/from the place of repair to the MOT station, but you must have an MOT appointment on your return journey to the MOT centre.

[davetrousers]

You can be (officially) 14 days late to tax your vehicle,

No you can't, this is a commonly quoted bit of lore.

Have a look at this link (http://www.askthe.police.uk/content/Q370.htm) or this link (http://www.dumfriesandgalloway.police.uk/faqs/motoring/car_tax.htm)

[Conor]

You can be (officially) 14 days late to tax your vehicle


Is completely incorrect. There is no 14 day "grace" period - it's nothing more than pub talk - and people have reported being sent out an automatic fine dated the day after the disc expired.

[Wig]

Here we go again.



Answer
No, there is no period of grace for road tax, if your car is on a public road without a valid tax disc you commit an offence and you could be fined.

I told OP not to use the car on the road with no VED.


My road fund licence ran out last night. Can I drive it for 14 days until I get another one?
No. There is no 14 day 'grace'. You must have a valid road fund licence.
See comment above.

See here
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/OwningAVehicle/HowToTaxYourVehicle/DG_069671

MOT or insurance has expired

If you intend to renew your vehicle tax you should do so before your current tax disc expires. However, this is not always possible if you’re waiting for insurance or are getting an MOT for your vehicle.You’ll be committing an offence if you use or keep your vehicle on the public road without a current tax disc. If you cannot obtain a tax disc, you must remove your vehicle off the road.
While your vehicle is off the road, you have 14 days in which to obtain a tax disc or make a SORN.

Conor, your mate in the pub :beer: about being fined the day after the expiry date is talking rubbish. Unless his vehicle was spotted on the highway - which is an altogether different subject.

Now, that is the official line, however, as I said even if it is not done before 14 days you still have until the end of the month, but the longer you leave it the more you risk things to go wrong, maybe the computer won't be updated in time. And if this happened and you appealed to the DVLA I suspect, if you could show you licensed it within 14 days your appeal would be upheld, but if you showed you licensed it on the 23rd of the month they might not uphold your appeal.

If you want this from the horses mouth phone the DVLA, and ask them when they check the vehicle database for non renewals.... they will tell you like they told me, that they check on the first of each month for discs that became due on the 1st of the previous month, they then action those defaults.....i.e. you get the whole month to buy your new disc, and as everyone knows when you buy the disc, it is backdated to the start of the month. What you must ensure is that the PO clerk knows you want the disc for the current month not the next month (most people will ofcourse be renewing early so you must make sure they know what you want).

[Keith]

and people have reported being sent out an automatic fine dated the day after the disc expired.

That is absolute rubbish, I left my vehicle until the 10th of the month until I renewed the tax (due to a delay receiving the insurance docs). I checked with vehicle enquiry and it showed the vehicle as "licence due to expire".

I also did 600 miles on public roads in that time, without getting stopped by the dibble.

[BigBouncyBall]

thanks - tbh i don;t see any reason it should fail - it has been a VERY reliable car and needed nothing other than windscreen washer fluid in 12 months!

fingers crossed!

as for the 14 day period i'll take a through look at all of that though obviously i'll get the tax done on Tues afternoon/Wed Morning if it passes.

[derrick]

ROTFLMAOWABIMH :rotfl::beer:

Here we go again, last time it was Derrick who said I was wrong on this.

.

You did not prove me wrong, there is no 14 days grace on RFL, it doesn't matter what you try to quote, you are committing an offence if you have a vehicle on the public highway without a valid RFL, or sorned if off road.

You have quotes from official sites above in post #5, and you still try to say there is a "grace period"

This is from the first link in that post and probably were you are being misled; -

However, the DVLA delay sending out such notices until 14 days after the licence is expired, which is where the myth that there is 14 days grace probably began.


And from the second link; -

My road fund licence ran out last night. Can I drive it for 14 days until I get another one?

No. There is no 14 day 'grace'. You must have a valid road fund licence.


Give it up Wig

[Wig]

You did not prove me wrong, there is no 14 days grace on RFL, it doesn't matter what you try to quote, you are committing an offence if you have a vehicle on the public highway without a valid RFL, or sorned if off road.

You have quotes from official sites above in post #5, and you still try to say there is a "grace period"

This is from the first link in that post and probably were you are being misled; -

However, the DVLA delay sending out such notices until 14 days after the licence is expired, which is where the myth that there is 14 days grace probably began.


And from the second link; -

My road fund licence ran out last night. Can I drive it for 14 days until I get another one?

No. There is no 14 day 'grace'. You must have a valid road fund licence.


Give it up Wig

Derrick, I cannot believe you still refuse to believe this, You forgot to critique my own link in my post above which proves this.

If you don't believe the Direct.gov website, then phone up DVLA and ask them.

I showed how each of the "official sites" above were misrepresenting this, they are both talking about using the vehicle on the road. Using the vehicle is a seperate issue, and it actually is allowed for booked appointments. Neither site is an official DVLA or DVLA related site. And if you ask me they should both be edited to give the whole 100% truth on this issue not the half truth.

[derrick]

Derrick, I cannot believe you still refuse to believe this, You forgot to critique my own link in my post above which proves this.

If you don't believe the Direct.gov website, then phone up DVLA and ask them.

I showed how each of the "official sites" above were being misrepresented on this, they are both talking about using the vehicle on the road. Neither site is an official DVLA or DVLA related site. And if you ask me they should both be edited to give the whole 100% truth on this issue not the half truth.

The first link in post #5 is from the Police National Legal Database.
Second link is from Dumfries and Galloway Constabulary.

Don't believe everything you read on Government websites!

It is an OFFENCE to have a vehicle on a public highway without a valid RFL, that is also on your Direct.gov website

From the link you gave, then from this page Car Tax Rules (http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/OwningAVehicle/HowToTaxYourVehicle/DG_10021514) via that link at the bottom of the page; -
"If you use or keep a vehicle on a public road, you must display a valid tax disc on it. As the registered keeper of the vehicle you’re responsible for taxing it or making a SORN (Statutory Off Road Notification) if it’s to be kept off the road."

Nowhere on that site does it say you have 14 days grace!

Besides anything else, why risk it?
Why keep arguing?

[BigBouncyBall]

stop it the pair of you

[Wig]

Derrick stop being a jerk. You are either trying to wind me up or can't read what has been written in this thread.

My last farewell link for you on this subject
http://www.dvla.gov.uk/media/pdf/leaflets/ins107.pdf (http://www.dvla.gov.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/170308_03.aspx)
if you are waiting for insurance or are getting an MOT for your vehicle, you may not be able to renew your tax on time. By law you, as the Registered Keeper, you will not be committing an offence if you tax the vehicle or make a SORN within 14 days of the date your current tax disc runs out. However, you must keep your vehicle off the road during this time as it is an offence to use your vehicle without displaying a valid tax discBon Voyage Derrick, I suppose you won't be back here just like when you never returned to the Road Vehicles Lighting Thread where I showed you were wrong there aswell......

Whether you guys like it or not, the DVLA does give you an official 14 days to renew.

[derrick]

Derrick stop being a jerk. You are either trying to wind me up or can't read what has been written in this thread.

My last farewell link for you on this subject
http://www.dvla.gov.uk/media/pdf/leaflets/ins107.pdf (http://www.dvla.gov.uk/pressoffice/pressreleases/170308_03.aspx)
Bon Voyage Derrick, I suppose you won't be back here just like when you never returned to the Road Vehicles Lighting Thread where I showed you were wrong there aswell......

Whether you guys like it or not, the DVLA does give you an official 14 days to renew.

The jerk is you by keep stating a lie, and cannot read what has been written in this thread.

Were would be the point in waiting 14 days, as even you have admitted you have to pay from the beginning of the month if you want to use your vehicle on a public road, so why wait?

There are 2 links above telling you there is not 14 days grace, your link does not actually say " 14 days grace" it appears to be in some very extenuating circumstance, and by the time you have taxed it in those Mythical 14 days it will be registered as taxed, and you cannot drive the vehicle legally on a public road without displaying a current RFL, so your point is academic.

The reason I never continued on the last post was that you were wrong there as you are now and the argument/debate was going round in circles , just as this one is, so I will not be coming back here either, so you can go back to whatever cloud cuckoo land you are inhabiting this time!

[banger9365]

here here derrick
a long time ago i got fined for having my ved out of date by two days by dvla WIG how do's that figure in what your saying and thing has got more stricter since then ,it only happend to me once and that was over tweenty years ago.
14 day grace my giddy aunt who are you kidding

and what happens when you go passed a ANPR camera with no tax the day after it ran out hay

quote from you post WIG "However, you must keep your vehicle off the road during this time as it is an offence to use your vehicle without displaying a valid tax disc"

[Wig]

What would be the point in waiting 14 days,
Read the OP Derrick, The poster has no MOT, while he is waiting to get a pass cert, he need not do anything for his tax status, and he need not worry about an automatic fine, it gives him peace of mind. The rule also (like it or not) gives people who just forget, the opportunity to renew and not get an automatic fine - hopefully they have avoided the police for the separate offence of using the vehicle in themeantime.

as even you have admitted you have to pay from the beginning of the month if you want to use your vehicle on a public road, so why wait?Doh, read my lips, no MOT.

There are 2 links above telling you there is not 14 days grace, your link does not actually say " 14 days grace"Being pedantic eh? Where in post #4 does it say "14 days grace"? Irrespective, I would call it a grace period from an automatic fine given by the DVLA no-one else but the DVLA, how else would you describe it?


it appears to be in some very extenuating circumstance,Oh it exists now does it Derrick? Be careful. However it will also be of comfort to all those people who have not been seen on the road but who forgot to renew their discs.

and by the time you have taxed it in those Mythical 14Ahh the old Derrick is back again,

days it will be registered as taxed, No s,,, Sherlock


and you cannot drive the vehicle legally on a public road without displaying a current RFL,Who said you could? - Except to an MOT appointment or a booked garage repair for the purposes of an MOT fail item? so your point is academic.But you admit I do have a point, that's a breakthrough, thanks Derrick.

The reason I never continued on the last post was that you were wrong there as you are nowLets be clear Derrick, I was talking about the thread where you and Conor decided I was wrong when I said you could obtain an MOT pass by masking out all the lights on a vehicle. After I showed it was true, you never reared your head there again.

go back to whatever cloud cuckoo land you are inhabiting this time!Yes Derrick, whatever you say.

[Wig]

here here derrick
a long time ago i got fined for having my ved out of date by two days by dvla WIG how do's that figure in what your saying and thing has got more stricter since then ,it only happend to me once and that was over tweenty years ago.
14 day grace my giddy aunt who are you kiddingLol, I'm sure your vehicle must have been seen on the highway. Continuous Regulation disn't even exist back then - (compulsory VED or SORN)

and what happens when you go passed a ANPR camera with no tax the day after it ran out hayYou might be investigated, but who said that wouldn't happen?

quote from you post WIG "However, you must keep your vehicle off the road during this time as it is an offence to use your vehicle without displaying a valid tax disc"Yes, well done, now read post #4 and tell me what that I wrote on this issue is wrong? (ignoring the bit in blue which is a different subject and I admit may be wrong.)

[derrick]

Read the OP Derrick, The poster has no MOT, while he is waiting to get a pass cert, he need not do anything for his tax status, and he need not worry about an automatic fine, it gives him peace of mind. The rule also (like it or not) gives people who just forget to be able to renew and not get an automatic fine - hopefully they avoid the police for the separate offence of using the vehicle.

Doh, read my lips, no MOT.

Being pedantic eh? Where in post #4 does it say "14 days grace"? Irrespective, I would call it a grace period from an automatic fine given by the DVLA no-one else but the DVLA, how else would you describe it?



Oh it exists now does it Derrick? Be careful. However it will also be of comfort to all those people who have not been seen on the road but who forgot to renew their discs.

Ahh the old Derrick is back again,

No s,,, Sherlock


Who said you could?But you admit I do have a point, that's a breakthrough, thanks Derrick.

Lets be clear Derrick, I was talking about the thread where you and Conor decided I was wrong when I said you could obtain an MOT pass by masking out all the lights on a vehicle. After I showed it was true, you never reared your head there again.
That was never proved, you cannot mask out all lights and get an MOT cert, what if it was foggy outside or very bad visibility? you would need those lights to get to and from the MOT centre. And as i said in my quote #15,(which you chose to edit); - The reason I never continued on the last post was that you were wrong there as you are now and the argument/debate was going round in circles

Yes Derrick, whatever you say.

And as usual you edit the quotes to suit your agenda.

Sorry I know I said I would not come back but those edited quotes are ludicrous:rotfl::rotfl:

[banger9365]

no ved no road full stop get fine end off

[Wig]

That was never proved, you cannot mask out all lights and get an MOT cert, what if it was foggy outside or very bad visibility? you would need those lights to get to and from the MOT centre

You're unbelievable Derrick (don't worry Conor is the same as you, you can keep each other company), even when the legislation is put infront of your nose you refuse to accept you are wrong. Fog and or bad visibility play no part in the regulations, all that matters is that it is between sunrise and sunset, you can opt to keep your fog lamps unmasked anyway.

So are you conceeding (in Derrick logic) that if it was a nice sunny day you could drive to an MOT and obtain a pass with masked out lights?

I'm not going to repeat the info on that thread, go and read it if you want to, or on the other hand, bury your head in the sand.

[derrick]

You're unbelievable Derrick (don't worry Conor is the same as you, you can keep each other company), even when the legislation is put infront of your nose you refuse to accept you are wrong. Fog and or bad visibility play no part in the regulations, all that matters is that it is between sunrise and sunset, you can opt to keep your fog lamps unmasked anyway. I'm not going to repeat the info on that thread, go and read it if you want to, or on the other hand, bury your head in the sand.

:wall: :wall: :wall:
ALL lights that need testing during the MOT need to be working whilst using the public highway, so Fog and or bad visibility DO play a part, because with those lights masked and bad visibility you are committing an offence as soon as you drive on the road, and I refuse to believe that an MOT tester would even look at a vehicle with masked out lights that need testing during the MOT.

I suggest you go and lie down in a dark room for a few hours, (or preferably weeks), as your medication seems to have worn off

[banger9365]

where in law do's it say you have 14 days grace and i mean law not a small paragraph on a web site
there only that small paragraph that you show ,showing the 14days thing and where do's it say it in law

[Wig]

ALL lights that need testing during the MOT need to be working whilst using the public highway, so Fog and or bad visibility DO play a part, because with those lights masked and bad visibility you are committing an offence as soon as you drive on the road
'Need testing' - here's a BIG hint for you, where front and rear position lamps are not fitted (to the vehicle), any lamp that is not fitted does not need to be tested.......... Go on, fall into the obvious trap.


and I refuse to believe that an MOT tester would even look at a vehicle with masked out lights that need testing during the MOT.Were it not for the use of those words "need testing" I would have told you to ask your next MOT tester. (see above, for lamps that need not be tested)

I suggest you go and lie down in a dark room for a few hours, (or preferably weeks), as your medication seems to have worn off
Yeah, ok, I'll lie down http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z102/wigphoto/funny.gif

[Wig]

where in law do's it say you have 14 days grace and i mean law not a small paragraph on a web site
there only that small paragraph that you show ,showing the 14days thing and where do's it say it in law

It doesn't have to say in law, the DVLA allow it before issuing an automatic penalty. If you phone them up they will confirm this to you.

The issue is whether or not you will automatically be given a penalty (BY the DVLA) if your vehicle is off the road - or going to/from an MOT appointment. The overwhelming evidence points to the fact that you will not. Not to mention the experience of all the people who have actually done this and recieved no penalty. And not one person that I have ever read about who has had a vehicle off the road after expiry has had an automatic penalty issued if they subsequently taxed or SORNd within the first 14 days. In practice its a great deal more than 14 days but we 'll stick to the official line.

As these penalties are issued by the DVLA and only by the DVLA, and the DVLA are the ones saying they won't issue them under such circumstances, I think that is good enough evidence to be able to tell the OP not to worry about getting one, don't you?

[derrick]

'Need testing' - here's a BIG hint for you, where front and rear position lamps are not fitted (to the vehicle), any lamp that is not fitted does not need to be tested.......... Go on, fall into the obvious trap.


Were it not for the use of those words "need testing" I would have told you to ask your next MOT tester. (see above, for lamps that need not be tested)


Yeah, ok, I'll lie down http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z102/wigphoto/funny.gif

You can't legally drive on the road without lights that work otherwise your vehicle would not pass the MOT,( don't forget as it passes the MOT, that is the only time you can be certain it is legal, if you drive away from the MOT centre with a pass cert and your brake light,or any other light that requires testing, decides to fail,after driving over a pothole for example, you now have a car that will fail the MOT, so your test cert might only be a few minutes old, but to conform to the law you need to replace the bulb to bring it back to MOT status), you still need working lights for daytime visibility for when there is bad visibility, i.e. fog or heavy rain greatly reducing your view of the road.

[Wig]

FGS Derrick go and read the other thread, the legislation is absolutely clear.

(3) Nothing in these Regulations shall require any lamp or reflector to be fitted between sunrise and sunset to-
(a) a vehicle not fitted with any front or rear position lamp,

[derrick]

FGS Derrick go and read the other thread, the legislation is absolutely clear.

(3) Nothing in these Regulations shall require any lamp or reflector to be fitted between sunrise and sunset to-
(a) a vehicle not fitted with any front or rear position lamp,

Try driving one on the road, I would love to hear your explanation to plod when you get pulled up, especially if it is foggy or bad visibility,(which it might not have been when you set off).

[derrick]

Going back to the original point of this thread,
OK I am going to sign of this thread and leave you to your ways and means,(you and I, Wig, are never going to agree on this issue), personally I will carry on as I have always done therefore making sure that I stay within the law, others will have to decide for themselves how they want to work it. I suggest that the better way to do the RFL and MOT is to have them some months apart, (mine are RFL expires at end of January, MOT expires at end of May, although I do the MOT a month before it is due, as it gives you up to a month to fix any problems that might occur on the test), and either remember the dates? or put them on a calendar or in a diary, some MOT stations will send you reminders, and DVLA might send you a reminder, although they are under no obligation to do so, and it may get lost in the post anyway, but there is always that big round sticker in the windscreen of the vehicle as a reminder.
And Wig, that goes to your rantings about lights!

[Wig]

Regulation 25 to which you refer, only aplies to vehicles fitted with front position lamps. Read Regulation 3 (above) again. The law recognises that if a car is not fitted with lamps, it would be impossible to turn them on. http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z102/wigphoto/funny.gif

If I got a numpty plod who decided to charge me on this, the response is simple "See you in court".

[derrick]

Regulation 25 to which you refer, only aplies to vehicles fitted with front position lamps. Read Regulation 3 (above) again. The law recognises that if a car is not fitted with lamps, it would be impossible to turn them on. http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z102/wigphoto/funny.gif

If I got a numpty plod who decided to charge me on this, the response is simple "See you in court".

:wave: Goodbye Wig, go for your lie down, you sure need it.

p.s. turn your spellchecker on!

[BigBouncyBall]

I wish i'd never asked :(

[CHR15]

Are you two married????

[skintchick]

Are you two married????

Or aged 14?

[McKneff]

we're getting bored now !!!!

[jeannieblue]

I think that they have either made up and run off together, or both have emigrated.

Meanwhile...

Lets not f*rt ar5e around.

If you don't have a current MOT certificate, you are driving a car illegally.

If you don't have road/car tax, you are driving a car illegally.

If you don't have insurance, you are driving a car illegally.

Or van or any other vehicle. You need all three to drive a car/vehicle legally.

It is that simple.. The only time that you can drive a vehicle legally that is not MOT'd, is if you are driving it to an MOT test. Make sure that the garage that you have booked the vehicle into for its MOT has your name, address, telephone number and registration number of your car. In other words, if you get pulled up by the police en route to the test, the garage will be able to prove that you are booked in for the test.

Now, that wasn't difficult, was it?

Over to you - Wig and Derrick - we've missed you x

[Wig]

The only time that you can drive a vehicle legally that is not MOT'd/VEDd, is if you are driving it to an MOT test.

Now, that wasn't difficult, was it

You forgot to say whether it would recieve an automatic DVLA penalty if it was VED/SORNd after expiry but within 14 days of expiry. Which is what I understood the OP was asking.. :D

[BigBouncyBall]

wow i wouldn't be shouting from the rooftops that i designed that site.

[MX5huggy]

What website?

There was some SPAM that has now gone