View Full Version : Saving Money Buying Hearing Aids
This site has plenty of advice regarding optics and dentistry and whatnot, but not hearing.
I work in private audiology (generally the dispensing of custom made hearing aids) and to be perfectly honest, people are getting utterly ripped off to the tune of thousands of pounds.
Professionals in my industry can essentially charge what they like as people are not inclined to shop around. Sadly, it is not uncommon to hear of people charged 2-3 times what they should have been. Just yesterday I saw someone who was being quoted close to £4000 for something we provide at less than £2000. We saved that person a lot of money today, but for every person that shops around and gets a better deal there are a handfull that lose thousands of pounds by not doing so.
I don't want to reveal who I work for for fear of jeopardising my job (they don't know I'm posting this!) But if anyone has any questions regarding purchases of specific products they or relatives/friends have made, quotes that have been given, or general questions about hearing and hearing aids themselves, I will happily answer them in a fair, objective and moneysaving-orientated manner. :)
(obviously, I can't/wont answer any specific medical related questions online - consult a qualified professional in person if you are concerned)
Savvy_Sue
16-07-2008, 2:59 AM
My advice to those who think they need hearing aids is to try the NHS first! And do NOT shell out on expensive private aids before you have got used to using an NHS aid. Because you will have some of the same 'issues' whichever you go for:
1) you will have to get used to something in your ear
2) everything will sound very loud
3) it won't bring your 'lost' hearing back, it can only enhance what's still there
This is not to say that for some people the benefits of a private aid are not worth it - I have two siblings who've gone down that route - BUT it is worth seeing what the NHS can do for free first.
Paparika
16-07-2008, 7:31 AM
I got mine free on the NHS, I can see why it's free.
It screeches every time a phone rings (working in a busy office wouldn't work)
I had to wait 6 weeks of sores on my ear before they changed it's length
but seeing as it is completely useless in the office i do work in it's collecting dust on my bedside cabinet.
Savvy_Sue
16-07-2008, 3:01 PM
I got mine free on the NHS, I can see why it's free.
It screeches every time a phone rings (working in a busy office wouldn't work)
I had to wait 6 weeks of sores on my ear before they changed it's length
but seeing as it is completely useless in the office i do work in it's collecting dust on my bedside cabinet.:rotfl: It really SHOULDN'T be like that: you can go back and ask for adjustment, and keep asking until they get it (roughly) right.
Mind spends most of its time in my pocket, but I do get it out for meetings and whenever there's a loop. Plus I've just declared my hearing loss to the airline we're flying with, I think that gets us boarded first! I didn't when we first booked because as I clicked through it assumed that declaring a hearing loss meant you were blind. :confused:
Savvy_Sue
16-07-2008, 7:23 PM
Thanks jim, now I know you encourage people to get on the NHS list I feel a lot happier about your posts!
I was astonished to discover that I went onto the 'Young People's Waiting List', simply by virtue of still being in paid employment. It doesn't seem fair however that people who might be very isolated but not working would have to remain isolated. Especially as some of them might be able to work if they could hear again! Anyway, that's another rant!
And we do in this area have an excellent system for aftercare: turn up any day and pick a number. Yes, sometimes there's a long wait, but I've never had a problem and I've usually been able to combine my visits with other trips to the hospital. If they can't sort it there and then they make an appointment, which has never been unacceptably delayed for me.
I wonder if the thinking behind dispensing one hearing aid is to see if people will use it: if they won't use one, why would they use two? I haven't been down that route because I've only got one deaf ear. Now I've got an open fit mould I could wear it all day, but my ear's between sizes (for the length of wire) so it's still not 100%.
I'm also awkward because it's a low frequency not a high frequency loss! I used to be able to hear my hearing aid 'whistle' when I'd accidentally left it switched on - the new mould means I don't any more - but DH can't hear it at all! :rotfl:
Oh, and I have friends and family who've got private aids as well - those who've gone straight to private are, on the whole, less satisfied than those who've tried the NHS and found it wanting. I guess they at least have some idea what they NEED and WANT that they're not getting.
My second bit of advice for anyone in need of a hearing aid, btw, is to find a local lipreading class (http://www.lipreading.org.uk/about_atla/classes.htm)! Invaluable source of information and support - that's how I found out about open fit moulds, a class member passing his new aid around! :rotfl:
Paparika
16-07-2008, 7:47 PM
I think i was fortunate then because i waited about 9 months start to finish.
But..... i had nose reconstruction and they used cartilage from my ear, and once i recovered from that op i noticed a considerable sound loss.
They said it had nothing to do with the op, but i had gradually lost my hearing and the op had bought it to my attention.
Savvy_Sue, You are very lucky to be in a PCT that dispenses open fitting instruments! There's certainly talk of it, but I've never worked in an area that does. In my opinion fitting a low frequency loss with one is in the "don't touch with a bargepole" territory, but something you learn very quickly in this business is that everyone hears differently and what may not work for one person may be perfect for another. :)
One third of all NHS provided hearing aids end up being stuck in a drawer and never used (this thread has already shown that). I firmly believe that this is due in a large part to being issued a single instrument for a binaural hearing loss. If the NHS only provide one in such a case, it is a cost driven decision to do so.
Many of my clients are shocked when I recommend two - I'm sure many think I'm just upselling - but really I would rather have someone buy two lower spec instruments than one fancier instrument for a single ear. I make less money, but they hear better... Invariably some will insist on only one and these are those that struggle most.
There is a stigma with wearing two hearing aids. Many people think it means you are "REALLY deaf", whereas one means "only a bit deaf". Many also think "deaf=stupid" so two aids means they are doubly stupid. I battle against such misconceptions every day.
Another big issue I enounter that you have touched on is that of managing people's expectations. No hearing aid can restore people's hearing to normal - some think they should do better than that! It is absolutely not like putting on a pair of glasses and everything is suddenly clear, it can easily take months to reacclimatise to hearing certain sounds in speech again.
I equate hearing loss and first using hearing aids to living in a darkened room. When you're in there, you know it's dark but you've adjusted and can just about make things out. Then one day you step outside into brilliant sunshine and the light is so brilliant that you cannot bear it - you can't make anything out because it is so bright. But over time you adjust and once you have completely it's appreciably better. If you then go back into the dark room you started in, you will realise what you were missing out on.
A Hearing Aid Audiologist's job is 50% audiology, 50% psychology.
Every privately dispensed hearing aid will come with a 30 day money back guarantee after fitting. This is not a special offer, this is enforcable by law. I encorage my clients to take advantage of this and insist I see them again at least twice in that period to assess how they are getting on and make any changes needed, which generally entails turning the aids up gradually to ease them into it. It's rare that it's perfect first time, but it's rarer that someone doesn't want to keep them after the 30 days is up.
Incidentally, to get a bit back onto the subject of saving money... I have lots of information that can help. BUT it starts dealing with mentioning specific companies, prices and possibly even leaked product information from a major supplier. What should/shouldn't I post?
Savvy_Sue
16-07-2008, 9:26 PM
I suggest you email abuse@moneysavingexpert.com and ask them what you should and shouldn't post. You shouldn't tout for business - and you haven't - and I'm not sure about the leaked product information!
As for the open fit moulds, it's relatively new. And I was told that it's the severity of the loss rather than the frequency - not saying you're wrong, just what I was told. As I have a mild loss, they thought I'd be fine, and I am much happier with it, can wear it all day even if I don't. I also thought that they worked out cheaper, because they're not personally fitted? Which, you would think, would make them the first choice where they are suitable. And since I was on my third ear mould in a year, and about to go back and say "It's still not comfortable", I reckon I'm definitely saving them some money! :rotfl:
One of my friends from lipreading will only wear one aid because he doesn't like the look of two (and he's got no hair to hide them with!) Others have only been given one because there's no useful hearing left in one ear - and one of them had that confirmed by a private chap! My mum only wears one for the same reason, and says some people seem to think it's a competition: "Oh I've got TWO hearing aids" (therefore I must be deafer than you). No, without either of their aids they can probably hear something. Mum takes her aid out and can't hear a dickybird. Or speech, or the phone, or the TV, or the doorbell. Actually even with her hearing aid in she only hears any of them if she's in the same room!
I am dreading the day when I get to the same stage, but at the same time I know life goes on! I've lived with deafness around me for so long that it seems normal to me ...
As for the open fit moulds, it's relatively new. And I was told that it's the severity of the loss rather than the frequency - not saying you're wrong, just what I was told. As I have a mild loss, they thought I'd be fine, and I am much happier with it, can wear it all day even if I don't.
I also have a problem mainly with the low frequency sounds - down to around 45db. I have made an appointment to go back and see the NHS clinic after last being there 3 and a half years ago. I'm a teacher and the aid I was given just does not handle the classroom situation at all - background noise drowns out the speech that I'm trying to make out.
I'd like to see if the NHS have something better to offer now and am interested in the open fit aids. What severity of loss do you have?
Savvy_Sue
14-09-2008, 2:38 PM
jem, my loss is mild, and only in one ear. Whether there is anything now available on the NHS now that wasn't then, I'm not sure, BUT I think the secret is to keep going back until you are happy. In theory there is a setting which amplifies only what's in front of you. However I don't find it cuts out background, just increases what's immediately in front. Slightly. I haven't got the patience to keep going back, especially since as far as I can see they have no functional way of testing there and then how the aids operate when there is background noise!
I saw my brother yesterday: he has a couple of private aids which are on their last legs. The case is breaking, and he glued it back together, but thinks he has glued shut an access hatch!
In true MSE style he decided a while back to try NHS aids, and said he eventually got them adjusted to be 'acceptable'. I'm not sure how many trips back it took: on one he said the technician said "I suppose we could turn up the volume." At that point they started to become useable for him.
His loss is severe, ie little point talking before he's got his aids in and switched on.
It is worth going back at regular intervals to get your ears re-tested anyway. Guess I must be due for a re-test soon ...
jem, my loss is mild, and only in one ear.
Do you know how many db that equates to?
"Open fit" generally means using a slim tube (about 1/3 the diameter of standard hearing aid tubing) with a small dome on the end, retaining it in the ear. This is advantagous in the sense that they are a lot more discreet and comfortable, but given the nature of acoustics and harmonics, they are not typically suited to low frequency amplification. They are designed for high frequency losses.
There's nothing to say it absolutely wont work, though. Everyone's hearing is unique and it could be successful for you. I'd view it as more as an option of last resort though.
Do you know how many db that equates to?
This varies from audiologist to audiologist, but I was taught with these rough bands:
<20dB loss = "within normal limits"
20-40dB = "mild"
40-70dB = "moderate"
70-95dB = "severe"
95dB+ = "profound"
This can be quite misleading to a layperson though. For example, A severe loss in the very high frequencies (6kHz+) alone will be nowhere near as noticable as a moderate loss in the mid-low frequencies.
Seems I'm on the cusp between mild and moderate then.
Incidentally, to get a bit back onto the subject of saving money... I have lots of information that can help. BUT it starts dealing with mentioning specific companies, prices and possibly even leaked product information from a major supplier. What should/shouldn't I post?
Would love any help on this please. Where would be good to go if I wanted to go down the private route?
Errata
14-09-2008, 8:12 PM
As Sue says, try NHS first and keep going back until everything's okey dokey.
My newest pair of NHS digital hearers have been tuned in and fitted so well I'm not aware of them most of the time, it truly felt like getting my natural hearing back.
If the waiting list at your local NHS place is lengthy, ask your GP for a referral to your nearest NHS place with a short waiting list - it will often be the area adjacent to your own. My local waiting list was 18 months but my adjacent NHS place took 6 weeks from GP referral letter being written to my second and final appointment.
As Sue says, try NHS first and keep going back until everything's okey dokey.
I have an appointment for the 26th of this month although not too sure how I will get on with it. It has been almost 4 years since I last had a hearing test done with them and an aid fitted in March 05. When making the appointment I said that I would like my hearing retested as I was not hearing well with the aid - I was told that it would just be the tube needing cleaned!
Hopefully the actual appointment will go better.
My main problem seems to be the classroom situation as it's a tricky one to handle.
Errata
14-09-2008, 9:30 PM
Blimey - have they got videophones ! Having said that, it mgiht need cleaning. Actually it might need replacing, my audiologist advised me to retube my hearers myself every three months to ensure I get the best out of them - the plastic can degrade and compromise the units ability to work at its full capacity.
Have you got digital aids? Mine have cut down the background noise considerably and I can flick a switch to cut it down even more.
The extra difficulty you're facing is that classrooms are all hard surfaces so ever sound bounces off them making background noise even worse.
HTH
Blimey - have they got videophones !
The wonders of the NHS today ;-)
Having said that, it mgiht need cleaning. Actually it might need replacing, my audiologist advised me to retube my hearers myself every three months to ensure I get the best out of them - the plastic can degrade and compromise the units ability to work at its full capacity.
I doubt they need cleaning as I very rarely use it these days. I can actually hear better without it.
Have you got digital aids?
I have one Siemens Prisma 2M digital aid. ( although my hearing loss is equal in both ears, not just one)
Mine have cut down the background noise considerably and I can flick a switch to cut it down even more.
I do have a setting between 1 and 2 - 2 is for noisy situations. Unfortunately it makes no difference.
The extra difficulty you're facing is that classrooms are all hard surfaces so ever sound bounces off them making background noise even worse.
HTH
I expect you are right. Wearing the aid makes me feel I'm in the middle of a wind tunnel.
Errata
14-09-2008, 9:43 PM
Ask for a retest, summat sounds not quite right if you can hear better without it.
I plan to. I would also like to find out if there are better aids that would suit my job. Hopefully the audiologist will be rather better than the receptionist who wasn't that nice.
jim83
14-09-2008, 10:04 PM
Would love any help on this please. Where would be good to go if I wanted to go down the private route?
There's a bit of a price war going on between Specsavers and David Ormerod (often found at larger Boots stores). With DO lowering their pricing and producing their own value range to compete with Specsavers entry into the market.
The key when dealing with both of these is to stick to the "own brand" stuff as it is exactly the same as the manufacturer branded products, only a lot cheaper.
DO are owned in part by Phonak (manufacturer) so their Digital Value range is using them as a supplier. Specsavers have a deal with Siemens, Starkey and Phonak to provide instruments for their Advance range. These represent excellent value for money if you compare to the prices of the same instruments with the brand name written on them.
These are not the only two options, but as far as I'm aware they are the only two with published price lists. Other places to consider are Hidden Hearing (owned by the same group that manufactures Oticon aids), Amplivox/Ultratone (trading under various names) and Scrivens (also trading under various names such as The Hearing Company). There are also plenty of smaller companies, independents and I think even Matalan have a hearing aid section in some stores now.
The same applies to any large purchase, but the absolutely critical thing to do is to shop around. With the introduction of Specsavers as a value player onto the market and the ensuing credit crunch, hearing aid dispensers are desperate for sales and will almost always drop their quotes to beat a competitor's price. Also, be aware that many hearing aid audiologists are trained salesmen who can resort to lying about the quality of service, etc. at other places in order to secure a sale (I have witnessed such things first hand whilst mystery shopping).
Also, ask about the following things as they can seriously affect the cost in the long term:
a) warranty period (standard is at least 2 years.)
b) repair charge outside of this period (this varies wildly - some firms inflate the prices to make it seem more economically viable to purchase a whole new aid)
c) cost of repeat tests, aftercare, reprogramming, etc. (this should be free)
d) expected longevity of the recommended instruments.
Also definitely definitely take advantage of the 30 day money back guarantee period you will get with any privately dispensed hearing aid. Think of it as a trial period. You have not committed to the purchase until after that point.
jim83
14-09-2008, 10:09 PM
Siemens Prisma 2 is a basic digital aid and still standard issue in many PCTs. A lot of my business is generated due to people simply not being able to get on with these.
Nothing against Siemens as a manufacturer, though. This is just old technology - some of their latest instruments are fantastic.
jem16
14-09-2008, 10:19 PM
Siemens Prisma 2 is a basic digital aid and still standard issue in many PCTs. A lot of my business is generated due to people simply not being able to get on with these.
Nothing against Siemens as a manufacturer, though. This is just old technology - some of their latest instruments are fantastic.
I thought as much.
I am hoping that they may be able to offer me something more up-to-date and I will pursue this first.
Thank you for the information on where to look privately.
Is there any manufacturer that you would recommend or are they all much the same? When comparing models what is the most important feature to look for, especially in my situation? Is it number of channels?
Savvy_Sue
14-09-2008, 10:28 PM
I know this is a bit of hearsay, but at my lipreading class last year the teacher said that she had heard nothing good from those who had used Hidden Hearing.
Also, if you're still with your original tubes, they do just degenerate over time, so it could be that. And if your mould gets blocked with ear wax, that stops it working quite effectively too. :o It can be blocked but not visibly so, IME.
What annoyed me about the tubes is that my clinic advertises a basic hearing aid maintenance class, teaching you to change your own tubes. I've asked to be put down for it on every single visit for the last 3 years, and NEVER heard any more.
Although it's no longer an issue now I've got my open fit mould: they change the whole thing!
Although I'm just wondering how long the tubes on them are supposed to last, and whether it's time to go and ask for a new one ...
jim83
14-09-2008, 11:45 PM
I thought as much.
I am hoping that they may be able to offer me something more up-to-date and I will pursue this first.
Thank you for the information on where to look privately.
Is there any manufacturer that you would recommend or are they all much the same? When comparing models what is the most important feature to look for, especially in my situation? Is it number of channels?
There is no single manufacurer that rises above the pack, really. They all have their own strengths and weaknesses. I can't really say what would be suitable for you personally, as this is something one tends to gleen from a consultation about usage, the cause/type of the hearing loss, hearing thresholds, shape/size of the ear, etc.
Number of channels provides a reasonable indication of how good an instrument is, but it is not definitive. For example, the mid-range Phonak Valeo (now discontinued) with 15 channels does not hold a candle to the top-of-the-range Starkey Destiny 1600 with 12 channels. Anything less than 6-8 channels and things start to get tricky, though.
Speaking purely in generalities, of the handful of teachers I have fitted hearing aids to, they have generally needed to go for higher end products because of the difficulties in hearing in a classroom. In one-to-one situations within noisy speech babble, directional microphones can make all the difference. And as well as that, it is the effectiveness of the automatic noise reduction.
Recently it has been purely the quality of the noise reduction that dictates the price. Unfortunately, this means it is difficult to quantify, particularly between manufacturers. Almost every aid has some form of noise reduction nowadays and it's all just a sea of brand names and trademarks, with nothing to provide direct comparisons. You are at the mercy of the audiologist's recommendation I'm afraid.
If you have a name of anything you have been recommended or quoted for, I will happily tell you objectively how it compares to other things and roughly what you can expect to pay. But it would be unprofessional to definitively state what you need without having met you ;)
jim83
15-09-2008, 12:06 AM
I know this is a bit of hearsay, but at my lipreading class last year the teacher said that she had heard nothing good from those who had used Hidden Hearing.
In the interests of providing comparison and not wanting to show any vested interest, I just gave a list of the major companies. Suffice it to say, some have better reputation than others ;)
I don't want to show any bias, but I do actually work for one of the companies mentioned and when it boils down to it I am simply a salesman on commission. I'd rather be taken seriously than with suspicion, so have opted not to focus on any single supplier.
Personally, if I was buying anything of high value, I'd be wary of any company that wouldn't tell me how much something costs without me being shut in a room with them as a captive audience... some hearing aid companies operate in this manner.
If you have a name of anything you have been recommended or quoted for, I will happily tell you objectively how it compares to other things and roughly what you can expect to pay. But it would be unprofessional to definitively state what you need without having met you ;)
At the moment I have only been to one company, Specsavers, as I am going to the NHS appointment before going any further. The audiologist recommended either receiver in the ear or completely in the canal as best suited for my hearing loss.
As to particular aid she said that I should go for the best I could afford! On pushing her further she said I should be at least considering the aids from £1195 up (per pair). As she knew I was intending seeing the NHS it seemed unfaid to take any more of her time at this stage. Looking at the leaflet I would probably say that the Advance 510/520 aid would be the most likely costwise for me. At a push the Advance 620/630 range if there really were much better. I have to say my main reluctance to spend more is because I have found the one I have to be pretty useless.
I have looked at other websites such as Affordable Hearing but their prices are for each aid rather than two so a decent paid would cost me about £2500.
David Ormerod at Boots would probably be my next port of call after the NHS.
I don't want to show any bias, but I do actually work for one of the companies mentioned and when it boils down to it I am simply a salesman on commission. I'd rather be taken seriously than with suspicion, so have opted not to focus on any single supplier.
I appreciate your honesty.
Personally, if I was buying anything of high value, I'd be wary of any company that wouldn't tell me how much something costs without me being shut in a room with them as a captive audience... some hearing aid companies operate in this manner.
I'd rather see the upfront prices too.
To highlight what I was saying about sticking to "own brand", it's worth noting that the Specsavers Advance 520 and 620 you have mentioned are effectively the Starkey Destiny 1200 and Destiny 1600. (you can confirm this by looking at the specifications.) They are being sold cheaper than the standard wholesale price + vat that most independent stores have to pay.
You will find that the Specsavers Advance products ending in 30 will be pretty much the same as the instruments in the David Ormerod Digital Value range. So it's definitely worth seeing what the audiologist there has to say about them.
Errata
15-09-2008, 3:54 PM
Jem, I've just had a thought. Phonak make an infra red wirefree mike/ receiver. It's a little larger than a fountain pen and you lay it on your desk or in your hand and point it at whoever's speaking and it gets transmitted straight into your hearing aid(s) through a small boot that clips onto the end of them. Cuts out all the background noise and I found mine invaluable when I was working and chairing large meetings in large rooms. Bit difficult to describe, but info is on the Phonak website - just google. HTH
To highlight what I was saying about sticking to "own brand", it's worth noting that the Specsavers Advance 520 and 620 you have mentioned are effectively the Starkey Destiny 1200 and Destiny 1600. (you can confirm this by looking at the specifications.) They are being sold cheaper than the standard wholesale price + vat that most independent stores have to pay.
You mentioned the Starkey Destiny 1600 earlier - would you say that it's worth the extra £200 over the Destiny 1200?
I have been trying to find the actual specifications but without success - most just have a list of features so not easy to compare.
You will find that the Specsavers Advance products ending in 30 will be pretty much the same as the instruments in the David Ormerod Digital Value range. So it's definitely worth seeing what the audiologist there has to say about them.
Are the Advance products ending in 10 and 20 inferior in any way?
Jem, I've just had a thought. Phonak make an infra red wirefree mike/ receiver. It's a little larger than a fountain pen and you lay it on your desk or in your hand and point it at whoever's speaking and it gets transmitted straight into your hearing aid(s) through a small boot that clips onto the end of them. Cuts out all the background noise and I found mine invaluable when I was working and chairing large meetings in large rooms. Bit difficult to describe, but info is on the Phonak website - just google. HTH
I tried to find this on Phonak's website but couldn't find anything. If you have a link that would be great.
Errata
15-09-2008, 6:07 PM
Just had a v quick google and found this, same as mine and I got mine about 8/9 years ago so there may be an even better model now.
http://www.connevans.com/technical/tx3.shtml
If it will help you in the classroom, your employer should pay for it under the Reasonable Adjustments rule. My employer paid for mine and at the time it was being dispensed to schoolchildren free on the NHS, but not adults.
jim83
16-09-2008, 12:06 AM
You mentioned the Starkey Destiny 1600 earlier - would you say that it's worth the extra £200 over the Destiny 1200?
I can't say whether or not it will be worth the money for you, but the 1600 is Starkey's flagship product so you can't go far wrong really. I've had a lot of success with it.
Starkey do tend to take a different approach to other manufacturers, opting for simplicity and ease of use over bells and whistles. Top of the line products from other manufacturers will include things like bluetooth integration, remote controls, etc. Starkey's selling feature is that the audiologist has as many tools as his or her disposal to get the prescription spot on with the aid in the ear.
Are the Advance products ending in 10 and 20 inferior in any way?
Not that I'm aware. As far as I'm concerned, ending in 10 means Siemens, 20 means Starkey and 30 means Phonak.
You're venturing into the realm of loop and FM systems in looking at the Phonak TX3 (these specifically have been discontinued, but there are newer things on the market).
This is Phonak's area of expertise really and if it's an avenue you want to explore, it's not uncommon for Phonak to get directly involved in the recommendation and fitting. But you should be aware that as a general rule this limits you to behind the ear hearing aids in a similar style to what you have tried from the NHS.
This sort of setup can get pretty costly. When I have provided them in the past it has been through Access to Work programs. To be honest, I'd speak to the audiologist about whether you are suitible for it. If you only have a mild loss it could be venturing into the "using a sledgehammer to crack a nut" territory.
Savvy_Sue
16-09-2008, 1:32 AM
I was beginning to wonder whether a personal loop thingy would help jem in class. If you wanted to try the cheap'n'cheerful option, RNID do the Sonido (http://www.rnid.org.uk/shop/products/listening_devices/)for less than £60. My sister can't function in meetings without one of the expensive ones (but she got that before the Sonido came out). I've had a play with hers in restaurants, and did find it helped a bit with eliminating background noise. We also all had a play with someone's Sonido in lipreading class ... One of my cousins JUST uses a communicator rather than a hearing aid.
One thing about getting anything like that under the Access to Work scheme is that it doesn't then belong to you. For that reason sis bought her own communicator, so that a) she can take it home and b) it can never be borrowed for anyone else's use at work.
Of course ONE of my problems with background noise is that one ear is fine. So while I can up the volume in my hearing aid, I can't shut down what comes in through the 'good' ear!
Not that I'm aware. As far as I'm concerned, ending in 10 means Siemens, 20 means Starkey and 30 means Phonak.
I see what you mean now. Do you know what the Advance 510 and 630 models are effectively?
You're venturing into the realm of loop and FM systems in looking at the Phonak TX3 (these specifically have been discontinued, but there are newer things on the market).
I don't think this would be any use to me. I'm a Primary teacher with 33 pupils in my class. A personal loop wouldn't be useful as I would have to pass it around the children. Installing a permanent one wouldn't help either as I may be in different classrooms each year depending on what age group I have.
To be honest, I'd speak to the audiologist about whether you are suitible for it. If you only have a mild loss it could be venturing into the "using a sledgehammer to crack a nut" territory.
Personally I don't see the need for it at all. I can manage without hearing aids by simply moving myself around the classroom if necessary. Meetings give me no problem at all and neither does communicating with parents or anybody else on a one-to-one basis. I would simply like better aids that would allow me to hear the children better in class without going over the top.
My hearing loss is at 45db at the most.
lolly5648
17-09-2008, 11:02 AM
Does anyone know anything about these - they were launched yesterday. My husband has hearing loss of the higher frequencies. He has an NHS aid which he wears occasionally at home for watching television but finds it uncomfortable.
He wants an in the ear aid that is not too noticeable that he could wear for meetings or when eating with friends in a noisy restaurant.
Our local PCT does not provide in the ear aids.
Savvy_Sue
18-09-2008, 2:20 AM
No, lolly, I don't, but I've merged you into an existing thread on hearing aids because I am sure our resident expert will have some suggestions.
Mine would be that if his hearing aid isn't comfortable he should go back and get the mould checked / get a new mould. I was on my third mould before I got my 'open-fit' one, and would have carried on hassling if that hadn't done the trick.
He wants an in the ear aid that is not too noticeable that he could wear for meetings or when eating with friends in a noisy restaurant.
To be perfectly honest, I think it would be a waste of £150. There's no chance they will work in any kind of noisy situation and as they're not programmed to prescription they will be of limited benefit elsewhere if your husband's hearing loss deviates at all from the average.
If he wants to try it, he should speak to someone at David Ormerod (this is the group that provides hearing services at Boots) and see if he can have it on the usual month's guarantee period. This is usually the case with all privately bought hearing instruments, but as the Hearplus is not to prescription I have a suspicion it could be exempt.
I can assure you that it is being used as a tool to get people through the door and sell them more appropriate hearing aids at much higher prices.
Definitely worth checking if the local PCT do open fitting aids yet. They are designed for high frequency losses, so may be perfect for your husband. They are still behind the ear, but a bit more discreet than the usual ones you see and a lot more comfortable.
Beyond that you can go privately, but you can realistically expect the costs to go up by a factor of ten.
Oh and apparently Specsavers also do something similar to this Hearplus. No prices on their website, but I'm sure it would be no more than at Boots.
jem16
26-09-2008, 11:33 AM
I had my appointment this morning, although it was a bit of a waste of time. My hearing aid was looked at and the tube was fine. I explained that the hearing aid wasn't helping my hearing and felt I needed the whole thing reviewed.
An ear impression was taken of my right ear and I have to get an appointment for a hearing test - will be in about 6 weeks! At that point I will get a newer aid apparently. I asked about open fit and was told it depended on my hearing loss which I already knew.
Barcode
26-09-2008, 2:15 PM
I guess I don't quite understand why the first port of call isn't the NHS. I too have the Siemens Prisma 2m, and I'm going to get some new ones next week after, oh, four years. They will be just the same as the sorts of things people pay thousands for elsewhere.
I guess I could understand it if the waiting list was huge, maybe. In my case, I went from hearing test to new aid fitting within a month. That's not been unusual in my dealings with the audiology dept. I also get batteries, and they are open should you need repairs.
I'd never pay thousands for hearing aids - seems madness to me.
I guess I don't quite understand why the first port of call isn't the NHS.
It is the first port of call :confused:
I'd be interested to know what these new aids the NHS are providing are. I was chatting to a sales manager for Siemens Hearing a few weeks ago and he was talking about the NHS potentially providing Siemens Reflex aids in some PCTs.
The Reflex is a rebranded Artis 2 (http://www.siemens-hearing.com/hearing-aids/artis2/) which, while certainly not top-of-the-range (most of the technology in it has been available privately for 4-5 years now), is very capable and a big step up from the aids provided in the past. You're currently looking at £1500+ a pair if dispensed privately I think. Though I'd imagine you'll find pricing restructured as a reaction to this soon enough.
It's actually a remote control compatible aid. I wonder if people could get those from the NHS as well? It would certainly help those with dexterity problems who struggle with current manual controls. Privately, they retail at about £80-120.
It's not exactly the same as privately dispensed hearing aids, though... Audiologically, this is being issued as a one-size-fits-all solution, whereas with a large pool of instruments to choose from, you get something a lot more bespoke privately. Also, these are still behind-the-ear only, whereas most of the time you'd get something custom-made in-the-ear or a small receiver-in-the-canal style from a private dispenser.
Professionally speaking, even if the Reflex is rolled out nationwide and waiting lists are brought down to a couple of weeks, it still does not concern me too much. It does not solve to core problems of physical comfort or cosmetics and the private sector is still at least a generation ahead in terms of technology.
Savvy_Sue
26-09-2008, 10:19 PM
I agree with Barcode, I know too many people whose first port of call ISN'T their local NHS audiology dept (or GP to ask for a referral), they know they're losing their hearing so they get a private test and end up paying a lot for a private hearing aid, because they think it will somehow be better than what's available on the NHS.
And it is true that you get CHOICE if you go private. And that applies not just to the aids you end up with, but when you get your appointments, and how easy it is to get good follow up.
However, I still say people should try NHS first, because for some of us it's perfectly adequate and acceptable. I don't understand why hearing aids are less cosmetically acceptable than glasses, or why some men whose hair doesn't cover their ears are too vain to wear them. But since I remember 'in the ear with a wire hanging down to the receiver and battery pack' styles, behind the ear is a great leap forward! :rotfl:
(I also remember my mum sewing a pocket on the back of my brother's t-shirts so that his hearing aid didn't fall out when he was cycling!)
jem, is your loss just in one ear? Or are they now investigating the other ear? I know jim feels that more people would benefit from having two aids than always get them. And some people struggle to co-ordinate one ear aided and the other 'au naturel', although I've never had a problem with that. Which is just as well because it is just the one ear which has gone! a great relief as I can't use the phone to my 'deaf' ear ...
jem16
26-09-2008, 10:25 PM
It is the first port of call :confused:
I'd be interested to know what these new aids the NHS are providing are. I was chatting to a sales manager for Siemens Hearing a few weeks ago and he was talking about the NHS potentially providing Siemens Reflex aids in some PCTs.
I'll let you know in around 6 weeks.
Also, these are still behind-the-ear only, whereas most of the time you'd get something custom-made in-the-ear or a small receiver-in-the-canal style from a private dispenser.
This is my main reason for looking at the private options. I'd prefer something that's small, discrete and comfortable.
jem16
26-09-2008, 10:36 PM
I don't understand why hearing aids are less cosmetically acceptable than glasses, or why some men whose hair doesn't cover their ears are too vain to wear them. But since I remember 'in the ear with a wire hanging down to the receiver and battery pack' styles, behind the ear is a great leap forward! :rotfl:
There are many who need glasses who opt for contact lenses rather than actual glasses. Much the same reason as those who would prefer discrete styles of hearing aid.
jem, is your loss just in one ear? Or are they now investigating the other ear?
The hearing test I had at Specsavers shows that my loss is exactly the same in both ears. I asked the NHS this morning about two aids and was told that if my hearing test showed I needed two aids then I would be offered two but that a lot of people don't want two. I was also told that my last hearing test with the NHS must have shown that I needed only one. As it was almost 4 years ago I can't remember although I am not aware of my hearing being worse than it was then.
I know jim feels that more people would benefit from having two aids than always get them.
I believe my mum has been given two aids but she doesn't use the 2nd one as she doesn't like both ears being blocked up and says that she still can't hear any better. At times she won't even wear one! I have tried to find out why she doesn't hear even with the aids and what kind of hearing loss she actually has but I never get a clear answer. I told her to ask about open fit on her last visit and apparently she is to get them on her next appointment. She thinks she has trouble with low frequency sounds too.
ostarjohn
27-09-2008, 12:19 AM
Hi everyone. I went to my audiology dept at the PCT today, for a simple re-tubing on my Prisma 2M. When I got there, the audiologist advised me that the left aid (I am lucky to have got both) was slightly damaged. This was news to me, but then she went on to inform me that they were now issuing the Reflex M models. As I had two aids, I would have to have both done! This was done, all within ten minutes, programmed, and tested. Fantastic! 12 channels, in each ear, plus wireless e2e (you can adjust the volume or change the program on either aid, and it automatically adjusts the other aid). I was not sure how beneficial all this would be, but after just one day I can say that this is truly a superior aid which is much more appropriate and easy to use. Hearing is better, more clear, and easier to adjust to different ambient sounds levels (changing to the loud noise cancelling program). all this for free on the NHS too.
The volume controls is different too. Instead of having a scale of 1 to 4, the wheel (known as VC) scrolls continuously, ie. no end stop. Once you have reached either end of the volume scale, the aid beeps three times to advise you that you have turned it down or up to the least/most possible. I was not sure how I would take to this adjustment, but believe me, after just a few hours, I was hooked on it!
If anyone else has any experiences of these aids, please let me know. I am on cloud nine right now.
john
Hi everyone. I went to my audiology dept at the PCT today, for a simple re-tubing on my Prisma 2M. When I got there, the audiologist advised me that the left aid (I am lucky to have got both) was slightly damaged. This was news to me, but then she went on to inform me that they were now issuing the Reflex M models.
Thanks. I will see if this is what I'm given when I get my hearing test.
My interest in going privately is the small receiver in the ear aids. I don't particularly like the ear mould as it makes me feel very blocked up. I know that my low frequency loss makes the normal open fit BTE aids unlikely (although apparently may be possible). I also like the fact that the receiver in the ear aids are very small.
I am going to get quotes from a few private dispensers. I know what Specsavers would charge and I have an appointment with my local Hearing Company frim (Clements & Osborne) next Saturday. I have also tried to get an appointment with Amplivox Hearing Centre but all I got so far was an answering machine. I will also try David Ormerod.
My real curiosity is that some will say the technology is more advanced within the private sector and I certainly like the sound of the receiver in the ear models whcih I know I will not get from the NHS. If I don't try the private aids I will always wonder if they are really better or not so I think I'm prepared to give it a go.
Savvy_Sue
27-09-2008, 6:18 PM
If I don't try the private aids I will always wonder if they are really better or not so I think I'm prepared to give it a go.a very sensible approach. And I have every sympathy with the feeling that the full ear mould blocks your ears up! My earlier comments relate to people who have headed down the private route without finding out what IS available on the NHS, and have then purchased something remarkably similar to what I'm wearing for free.
And you are struggling, and not feeling that you're benefiting from the NHS aid you have. I do hope that going private gets you what you NEED.
a very sensible approach. And I have every sympathy with the feeling that the full ear mould blocks your ears up! My earlier comments relate to people who have headed down the private route without finding out what IS available on the NHS, and have then purchased something remarkably similar to what I'm wearing for free.
I admit this is my worry. I will still go with the NHS and get another test and a new aid or aids. Hopefully I can get the open fit style.
And you are struggling, and not feeling that you're benefiting from the NHS aid you have. I do hope that going private gets you what you NEED.
Thanks - I would like to trial them. Hopefully if I really feel no extra benefit I will be able to get my money back as the guarantee states. How good this guarantee is remains to be seen.
If you have a name of anything you have been recommended or quoted for, I will happily tell you objectively how it compares to other things and roughly what you can expect to pay. But it would be unprofessional to definitively state what you need without having met you ;)
I went to David Ormerod's this morning. My hearing loss was described as reverse slope loss and sensorineural. In the low frequencies it is about 40/45db, sloping up through the mid frequencies at around 30/35 till the highest frequency at just under normal. My ears are quite small apparently. Bothe ears show the same loss (only varying by around 5db with the left ear being slightly better)
He said that CIC would not be good as my ear is too small and open fit not good as my loss is mainly low frequencies. He suggested half shell or receiver in the ear models.
His main recommendations were the Metrix(I think that's right) in the digital value range but only available in the half shell. These would be £1695 for the pair with a 2 year guarantee. The other one would be the ReSound Dot 10 which because of a 20% summer sale (ending tomorrow) would be £1720. These come with a 5yr guarantee. Both would be available on a 60 day trial.
I'm leaning more towards to Dot as it's tiny and barely noticeable with just a thin tube going into the ear. He feels that the Dot 20 at around £900 more would not be necessary as I wouldn't notice an extra £900s worth of improvement.
Problem is that I would need to tell him by tomorrow to get the 20% off otherwise it goes up to £2150. I have an appointment with a local dispenser next Saturday but is that a good price for the Dots?
Would be great if I had your thoughts on this?
Don't be swayed by the offer on the Dot 10. It's a good aid, but still overpriced with the offer on it. The Dot has three price points - what you are looking at is the entry level. I am surprised you weren't offered a Phonak aid, Ormerods near me is shifting them like nobody's business..
I'd hit up Specsavers againt to be honest. Their Advance 621 for £1595 is the Starkey Zon 7 - similar style, way better tech and a lot cheaper than your quote there. (again, 3 price points with Starkey, but this is the top of the range)
Any dispenser you will go to will be chomping at the bit to get you to trial aids with them. This recession is hitting the industry very hard, so they all will offer to beat any quote, or they'll throw in extras like a years supply of batteries, or 5 years warrantys. Try your hardest not to be "sold to". It is a buyers' market.
Also, ask about the cost of non-warrany repairs and any other aftercare. This can vary wildly.
jem16
29-09-2008, 10:13 PM
Don't be swayed by the offer on the Dot 10. It's a good aid, but still overpriced with the offer on it. The Dot has three price points - what you are looking at is the entry level. I am surprised you weren't offered a Phonak aid, Ormerods near me is shifting them like nobody's business..
I'm sure I read that Phonak had purchased GN Resound so that might account for it. I was told that the Dot 10 was the entry level but that I didn't need the Dot 20 so why pay extra.
I have now been told that the Specsavers 430 and 421 is essentially the same and is only £1195 although the guarantee is 2 years. An extra £199 takes it up to 4 years, so £1394.
I'd hit up Specsavers againt to be honest. Their Advance 621 for £1595 is the Starkey Zon 7 - similar style, way better tech and a lot cheaper than your quote there. (again, 3 price points with Starkey, but this is the top of the range)
My leaflet and their website only mentions the 620 and 630. It doesn't mention the 621?
Any dispenser you will go to will be chomping at the bit to get you to trial aids with them. This recession is hitting the industry very hard, so they all will offer to beat any quote, or they'll throw in extras like a years supply of batteries, or 5 years warrantys. Try your hardest not to be "sold to". It is a buyers' market.
I suppose he was quite good in that he didn't try to sell me the dearest aid but in actual fact the cheapest one. However I will leave it until I see the local dispenser I was going to see on Saturday and see what he is offering armed with the prices I already have.
Also, ask about the cost of non-warrany repairs and any other aftercare. This can vary wildly.
What would a non-warranty repair be? I would have thought that everything apart from loss would be covered.
Errata
29-09-2008, 10:16 PM
What would a non-warranty repair be? I would have thought that everything apart from loss would be covered
Dropping it in the bathroom washbasin
Chewed by dog
jem16
29-09-2008, 10:20 PM
Dropping it in the bathroom washbasin
Chewed by dog
Ah never thought of accidental damage - perhaps my house insurance would cover that?
Savvy_Sue
30-09-2008, 12:26 AM
Dropping it in the bathroom washbasin
Chewed by dogI may have mentioned that my local hearing aid clinic has a display of 'aids chewed by dogs'. :rotfl:
It's a bit worrying (not that we have a dog) because I used to be able to hear mine whistling if I left it on accidentally - DH can't! - but now I've got the Open Fit mould I can't hear it at all.
Ah never thought of accidental damage - perhaps my house insurance would cover that?You would need to check: you might need to make your hearing aids 'named items' because they could well be over the value of things 'generally' covered.
You would need to check: you might need to make your hearing aids 'named items' because they could well be over the value of things 'generally' covered.
I have all risks on personal possessions for each item up to £1500. So should be ok but I would check.
I'd hit up Specsavers againt to be honest. Their Advance 621 for £1595 is the Starkey Zon 7 - similar style, way better tech and a lot cheaper than your quote there. (again, 3 price points with Starkey, but this is the top of the range)
Are Specsavers models just rebranded or are they older models? The reason I ask is that David Ormerod's told me their value range was older models whilst their premium range was the newer models? True or just sales talk?
Als when you say that the 621 is the Starkey Zon 7 - is it actually that hearing aid simply rebranded or is it the equivalent of that model?
Are Specsavers models just rebranded or are they older models? The reason I ask is that David Ormerod's told me their value range was older models whilst their premium range was the newer models? True or just sales talk?
To be honest, I'm not 100% sure. The starkey ones are current, but as far as the Siemens and Phonak, I don't really know.
Als when you say that the 621 is the Starkey Zon 7 - is it actually that hearing aid simply rebranded or is it the equivalent of that model?
It's definitely that hearing aid rebranded.
... I'm sure I posted here last night responding to the warranty questions? maybe I forgot to press submit? Oh well.
It's definitely that hearing aid rebranded.
I take it you like the Starkey models?
... I'm sure I posted here last night responding to the warranty questions? maybe I forgot to press submit? Oh well.
No problem. I hadn't thought about accidental damage.
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